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The J.R.S.
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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 Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:22 am Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | If i may add to this debate... Shouldnt Joeckel be compared to Jason Smith rather than Monroe?...
But this class is much better than that class, I remember that there were definitely more "reaches" in that class where as the only reach when you put it on paper will be the Chiefs at number 1. |
I still cannot fathom how anyone thought Jason Smith was the top OT prospect in that class. In my mind, and I said this at the time, he was the 4th best prospect. There is evidence that strongly supports experience is the most important factor in collegiate linemen transitioning into the NFL successfully.
Much like Curry, people fell in love with Smith's athleticism and forgot that football skill matters.
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DEE RAWL
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
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Location: Southern California
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| The J.R.S. wrote: | | DEE RAWL wrote: | If i may add to this debate... Shouldnt Joeckel be compared to Jason Smith rather than Monroe?...
But this class is much better than that class, I remember that there were definitely more "reaches" in that class where as the only reach when you put it on paper will be the Chiefs at number 1. |
I still cannot fathom how anyone thought Jason Smith was the top OT prospect in that class. In my mind, and I said this at the time, he was the 4th best prospect. There is evidence that strongly supports experience is the most important factor in collegiate linemen transitioning into the NFL successfully.
Much like Curry, people fell in love with Smith's athleticism and forgot that football skill matters. |
Precisely why i dont get all caught up (for better or for worse) with prospects that shoot up the boards based on their combine numbers. And why I defend prospects like Keenan Allen who may not wow you on paper but are just footballers. Also why i hate going for "potential", id rather have a tried and proven player. Not to say that the freak athletes cant translate it to the field and potentially be a home run, but rarely does the risk pay off it seems like.
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2017 Draft Priority for Pick 37
1. Corey Davis, WR, WMU
2. Forrest Lamp, G/C, WKU
3. Evan Engram, TE, Ole Miss
4. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR, USC |
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jrry32
Joined: 04 Jan 2011
Posts: 69131
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:57 am Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | If i may add to this debate... Shouldnt Joeckel be compared to Jason Smith rather than Monroe?...
But this class is much better than that class, I remember that there were definitely more "reaches" in that class where as the only reach when you put it on paper will be the Chiefs at number 1. |
I ranked Monroe at the top LT in that class.
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The J.R.S.
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | | The J.R.S. wrote: | | DEE RAWL wrote: | If i may add to this debate... Shouldnt Joeckel be compared to Jason Smith rather than Monroe?...
But this class is much better than that class, I remember that there were definitely more "reaches" in that class where as the only reach when you put it on paper will be the Chiefs at number 1. |
I still cannot fathom how anyone thought Jason Smith was the top OT prospect in that class. In my mind, and I said this at the time, he was the 4th best prospect. There is evidence that strongly supports experience is the most important factor in collegiate linemen transitioning into the NFL successfully.
Much like Curry, people fell in love with Smith's athleticism and forgot that football skill matters. |
Precisely why i dont get all caught up (for better or for worse) with prospects that shoot up the boards based on their combine numbers. And why I defend prospects like Keenan Allen who may not wow you on paper but are just footballers. Also why i hate going for "potential", id rather have a tried and proven player. Not to say that the freak athletes cant translate it to the field and potentially be a home run, but rarely does the risk pay off it seems like. |
I have to point out that this is the exact opposite stance that you took last year with Justin Blackmon.
Very few of the combine numbers matter to me as well. How often are players asked in game to run 40 yards, in a straight line, out of a sprinter's stance, in runner's shoes, clear of obstruction, and without pads? 
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DEE RAWL
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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Well, you are half right. I had the same stance about potential and while i validated Blackmon's playing ability, I didnt think he was worth a top 10 selection. Same thing with Allen-- I love Allen as most of you know, but he also isnt worth a top 10 selection. If we had the 16th selection last year I would have loved Blackmon had he been an option (however I still would have preferred Floyd). I still laugh everytime I think about the fact that somebody traded UP to take him 5th overall.
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2017 Draft Priority for Pick 37
1. Corey Davis, WR, WMU
2. Forrest Lamp, G/C, WKU
3. Evan Engram, TE, Ole Miss
4. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR, USC |
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The J.R.S.
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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Location: Next to Waldo
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| Posted: Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:09 pm Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | | Well, you are half right. I had the same stance about potential and while i validated Blackmon's playing ability, I didnt think he was worth a top 10 selection. Same thing with Allen-- I love Allen as most of you know, but he also isnt worth a top 10 selection. If we had the 16th selection last year I would have loved Blackmon had he been an option (however I still would have preferred Floyd). I still laugh everytime I think about the fact that somebody traded UP to take him 5th overall. |
I thought trading up for him was silly as well. He has shown some nice potential in his first year, despite the terrible QB situation that he has dealt with.
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ajhicks11
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at.
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DEE RAWL
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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| ajhicks11 wrote: | I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at. |
Never
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2017 Draft Priority for Pick 37
1. Corey Davis, WR, WMU
2. Forrest Lamp, G/C, WKU
3. Evan Engram, TE, Ole Miss
4. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR, USC |
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STLRamsFan99
Joined: 17 Aug 2012
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:33 pm Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | | ajhicks11 wrote: | I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at. |
Never |
The pistol doesn't fit the Rams and the read option stuff will #1 priority in the off-season for Defensive Coordinators.
Like with every trend in the league, teams will adapt.
I agree with DEE RAWL. |
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The J.R.S.
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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Location: Next to Waldo
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:03 am Post subject: |
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| DEE RAWL wrote: | | ajhicks11 wrote: | I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at. |
Never |
+1
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iRaMs
Joined: 05 May 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:55 am Post subject: |
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| The J.R.S. wrote: | | DEE RAWL wrote: | | ajhicks11 wrote: | I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at. |
Never |
+1 |
yeah, that would be terrible.
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The J.R.S.
Joined: 15 Feb 2007
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Location: Next to Waldo
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| iRaMs wrote: | | The J.R.S. wrote: | | DEE RAWL wrote: | | ajhicks11 wrote: | I don't want to create a new topic but i just wanted to ask this question. What do you think about the Rams adding the pistol formation to their plays? (heck what about all of the teams)
I know Sam doesn't have a huge threat to run the ball but he is athletic enough to run. He also has the ability to throw the ball extremely well on the run. I really think the Rams could add plays to the book out of the pistol that we could really succeed at. |
Never |
+1 |
yeah, that would be terrible. |
Eventually, teams other than the Rams are going to realize that Kaepernick only runs one routinely successful "pistol" play. It is the one that is a read/option in which he either hands the ball to the RB, or he he keeps it and runs off tackle. A simple defensive alignment is all that is required to keep Kaep at bay. (See what I did there?)
Kaep's coach at Nevada called that play "samurai" apparently. San Francisco has a good offensive line and if their play falters, so goes the success of that pistol offense.
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ajhicks11
Joined: 15 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:58 pm Post subject: |
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I have been under the impression that the "pistol" formation stands different from the "read option" as that seems like it is just a play within the formation.
The read option probably adds to the effectiveness of the pistol formation, but it seems like a variant could be put into any offense. I love the play action it can offer on passing plays.
I really realize we do not have a threat to run the read option. Maybe i need to understand the formation more but it really seems like we could run that formation minus the read option.
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DEE RAWL
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 6106
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| Posted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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| ajhicks11 wrote: | I have been under the impression that the "pistol" formation stands different from the "read option" as that seems like it is just a play within the formation.
The read option probably adds to the effectiveness of the pistol formation, but it seems like a variant could be put into any offense. I love the play action it can offer on passing plays.
I really realize we do not have a threat to run the read option. Maybe i need to understand the formation more but it really seems like we could run that formation minus the read option. |
You are correct in that you dont have to run the read with the pistol... BUT, if thats the case then there isnt much of a reason to put it in. The reason it was created was to allow the runningback to come down hill like traditional under center formations-- as oppose to shotgun where runningbacks are even with the quarterback causing a lateral playfakes and handoffs which often makes the defense easier to play both.
My point is, changing/adding the pistol without implementing read option variations would be a waste of time as it makes no difference.
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2017 Draft Priority for Pick 37
1. Corey Davis, WR, WMU
2. Forrest Lamp, G/C, WKU
3. Evan Engram, TE, Ole Miss
4. JuJu Smith-Schuster, WR, USC |
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Cornbread5
Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 440
Location: New York, NY
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| Posted: Tue Jan 22, 2013 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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RE: WR early in the draft...
Does anyone think it's crazy for the Rams to take DeAndre Hopkins in the first? He looks like the best all around receiver and probably has the least amount of questions about his game. He's big, physical, fast and has great hands. At Clemson, he proved no one guy could cover him and he gave one of the best receiving performances on the big stage against a dominant SEC secondary. How is he not a first round pick?
Other than him, I like Allen or Hunter in the first round but not really any of the other prospects. I think after the combine everyone will realize what a rare talent Hunter is again and he'll go right back into first round mocks.
I really don't get the love for T Williams in the first but I may be missing something. Also, D Rogers is a sleeper I believe in the draft and could be the same kind of second day steal J Jenkins was for the Rams last year. Best case for the Rams could possibly be taking a S, OL in the first and hoping Rogers is there in the second.
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