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Lovie Smith to Interview in San Diego
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ChicagoAl


Joined: 10 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Superman(DH23) wrote:
GOGRIESE wrote:
Superman(DH23) wrote:
The LBC wrote:
vikingsrule wrote:
Do the chargers have the pieces to run a Cover 2 defense?

Donald Butler is a safe bet at MLB. Can Ingram and Phillips play with there hand in the dirt. Do they have interior lineman needed.

Ingram likely ends up as an OLB in the Cover-2 which isn't wholly unthinkable given his skill-set (the Briggs to Butler's Urlacher). Liuget actually projects rather well as a C-2 NT, which would slot in Reyes as the UT - another good fit.

I just don't see this as a particularly smart move considering it pigeonholes the team into likely needing to use it's #11 selection on a RDE - since the depth for pure 4-3 DE's isn't stellar in this class. Phillips is a free agent and while he could play the position it's not his ideal fit - much rather be able to play him at the OLB, if re-signed. Weddle could thrive in the C-2 as a safety, but I'm not sure we have another guy on the roster at safety that's a tremendous fit without cycling say Marcus Gilchrist back there or signing someone in FA.

It seems like just an unnecessary transition - particularly with Peyton in the divisionn considering Peyton's historically trashed Cover-2's that we're 3-deep with high-level pass-rushers across the front four. It's looking more and more like Lovie's a RR candidate that's getting the benefit of the doubt because of his past track record. Our ownership seems to really favor holding onto John Pagano, which would mean retaining the 3-4 - it may just take an interview with Lovie for that point to get across to them about him.
You might want to look at what Peyton acutally did against the Bears in the SuperBowl. They were gashed by 200 yards rushing (thank you Ron Rivera) but not by Peyton. Then in 2008 they did it to Peyton again. Also look at that Aaron Rodgers' worst games generally come against the Bears. But I'm not sold that Lovie would completely change that defense anyway, but may adapt it similar to what Tomlin did in Pittsburgh.

I think the Chargers right now are strongly leaning towards an offensive candidate b/c the #1 goal is to get Philip Rivers right again, but it wouldn't shock me if Lovie completely blew them away in an interview and was able to get Pep Hamilton or Hue Jackson in as his OC.


Laughing I love it when your trying to pump up his resume by saying something he will not do.
So I suppose we always ran cover 2 huh, and never adapted to the personnel we had, oh wait we did adapt, several times. The double A-gap blitz that we pioneered and mixed in since 2008 was developed specifically b/c we couldn't get pressure w/ the front 4, so we essentially gave a look to offenses where they never knew if the blitz was coming or if the LBs were going to drop. Playing Shea as a standup rover who moved all over the line this year. No we didn't do any of those things. Lovie has always changed his defense to match his personnel. He changed the Tampa 2 from what it was in Tampa when he first got to Chicago b/c he had the most athletic MLB in the league at the time so he put a lot more responsibility on that position. B

But it's fun to senselesely hate on the 3rd winningest coach in the history of the oldest franchise in football for no reason other than you just don't like him.
Third winningest only because he was here NINE years, six of which we watched as the playoffs featured OTHER teams. Two really good years with more of the others NOT winning than winning.

Those of us who knew Smith had to go did not and do not "hate" him, just his inability to get us anywhere after 2006. It was downhill for him after that.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GOGRIESE wrote:
Superman(DH23) wrote:
GOGRIESE wrote:


Im well aware we dont run the Tampa 2 a majority of the time. Im also aware of why they did all those things in your long paragraph(mostly because something was going wrong). I was present when they made those changes. I saw them put in place.

But the thing you totally missed is that the Chargers have a pretty good 3-4 defense. If you think he isnt going to go in there and rip that out then your living on a different planet.We all know how much he believes in and loves his system. We also know what he thinks about the 3-4 defense which isnt much. Lovie Smith doesnt need you pumping up his resume. The guy is making over 5 million dollars if he gets hired or not. He is going to be just fine so lay off.

Btw your completely wrong. I dont hate Lovie Smith. But it was a good time to move on. The was a few reasons he got fired. Phil Emery explained all of that.
yes he believes in his system which is predacated on 22 eyes on the QB. I believe that Lovie could adapt that philosophy to a hybrid front (we've done this ourselves at times) to utilize the guys he has. I could easily see him using Ingram in the same way they used Shea this year.


Well in the end Shea I believe needs to be standing up full time at OLB(3-4). This is a pointless argument anyway because the most important thing hasnt even happened yet. Lovie Smith hasnt interviewed with anyone other than the Bills.
Now the Eagles are going through the charade. They won't hire him, of course, and there is no enthusiasm from their fans to do so. Most would be ok if he was hired as a DC but only a couple of delusionary fans want him as HC.

They seem to like McCoy as much as our fans and may be the biggest competition for him to us and San Diego as is likely too.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.
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Badger75


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So HC Smith collects $5M from the Bears, plays golf, stays fit, does some scouting and comes back next year.

The modern NFL moves very fast. There is always a team with a broken wheel on defense.

Paul Brown was fired in 1963 with three years left on a lucrative contract. SI listed him as the most over paid out of work sportsman of the era. Cool
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JammerHammer21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
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Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
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The LBC


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Badger75 wrote:
So HC Smith collects $5M from the Bears, plays golf, stays fit, does some scouting and comes back next year.

The modern NFL moves very fast. There is always a team with a broken wheel on defense.

Paul Brown was fired in 1963 with three years left on a lucrative contract. SI listed him as the most over paid out of work sportsman of the era. Cool

He strikes me as a Jeff Fisher type. He hasn't won the big one (at least not as the head cheese) but he's been to the big one and has championship experience.

Take a year off, do some scouting as you said, and start working your pipeline to other staffs to find that thing that's always seemed to elude Lovie: a good-to-great offensive coordinator, and he's got a great shot at being an early hire next offseason for one of these teams that has been mired in mediocrity or worse for some time and need to dig themselves out (I could see sitting tight and waiting on either the Carolina - possibly, Tennessee, or Jets jobs).
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The LBC


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.

Since you're such an expert on the subject, PLEASE (literally, I'd love to hear what you think you know) educate me on the context. Because I'd lay money you haven't got a clue.
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JammerHammer21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LBC wrote:
Badger75 wrote:
So HC Smith collects $5M from the Bears, plays golf, stays fit, does some scouting and comes back next year.

The modern NFL moves very fast. There is always a team with a broken wheel on defense.

Paul Brown was fired in 1963 with three years left on a lucrative contract. SI listed him as the most over paid out of work sportsman of the era. Cool

He strikes me as a Jeff Fisher type. He hasn't won the big one (at least not as the head cheese) but he's been to the big one and has championship experience.

Take a year off, do some scouting as you said, and start working your pipeline to other staffs to find that thing that's always seemed to elude Lovie: a good-to-great offensive coordinator, and he's got a great shot at being an early hire next offseason for one of these teams that has been mired in mediocrity or worse for some time and need to dig themselves out (I could see sitting tight and waiting on either the Carolina - possibly, Tennessee, or Jets jobs).


He's been connected to Pep, who I think could do pretty well in the NFL.
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Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.
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JammerHammer21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.


Considering Norv A) Got farther than Marty ever did and B) once went 13-3.... Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
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Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
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ChicagoAl


Joined: 10 Jan 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LBC wrote:
Badger75 wrote:
So HC Smith collects $5M from the Bears, plays golf, stays fit, does some scouting and comes back next year.

The modern NFL moves very fast. There is always a team with a broken wheel on defense.

Paul Brown was fired in 1963 with three years left on a lucrative contract. SI listed him as the most over paid out of work sportsman of the era. Cool

He strikes me as a Jeff Fisher type. He hasn't won the big one (at least not as the head cheese) but he's been to the big one and has championship experience.

Take a year off, do some scouting as you said, and start working your pipeline to other staffs to find that thing that's always seemed to elude Lovie: a good-to-great offensive coordinator, and he's got a great shot at being an early hire next offseason for one of these teams that has been mired in mediocrity or worse for some time and need to dig themselves out (I could see sitting tight and waiting on either the Carolina - possibly, Tennessee, or Jets jobs).
Smith is a terrible game day coach. If his plan is working he is hard to beat but if it is not he could not make a game-winning adjustment to save his life.

As to scouting, he was always scouting and our roster reflects his wishes as much or more than anyone. He has NO ability to find or develop offensive talent. His teams were good at beating up on tomato cans but good teams beat him like a drum.

He could not, even after NINE years, assure that plays get to the QB in time for him to audible or change formations . His career here was excellent the first three years and nothing worth speaking of after that. One playoff appearance in six years. In the last twelve games when behind at the half we had ONE victory. Hence, when we got behind we lost almost inevitably.

If Bill Cowher and Billick can't generate any interest for HC jobs, Smith will never be a HC in the NFL again.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.

That's not even an argument. Your contention was that it was "over" for San Diego when they fired Marty. Now you're changing your stance to it was over when they hired Norv. Make up your mind.

But even in your amended contention you're horribly wrong, either that or you're just terrible at math. Last I checked 13-3 (the Chargers' 2009 season record) is only a one standard deviation from 14-2 (the best record under Marty). Considering that we don't calculate in terms of half-games, that's about as "close" as you're going to find without matching or beating the record.

Now, if you'd like to explore actual facts and look at the context of Marty's firing, I'm more than happy to indulge you. Marty ran himself out the door when he didn't get the extension he was demanding following that 14-2 season - largely because the owner and front office recognized Marty for what his role was that season: A rah-rah guy whose coordinators were doing all the leg-work for... coordinators who had both been hired away and whom he was failing to bring sufficient replacements for (attempted to hire his brother whose most recent body of work was the defense of a 3-win Lions team that ranked in the bottom quarter of the league and who had been Marty's DC in the year-prior-to-his-firing of every single one of his previous HC gigs).

I'm not going to argue that hiring Norv Turner was either smart nor particularly great. It did aid the development of Philip Rivers so I can't feel completely terrible about it - and had Norv been fired after the first or second year we failed to make the playoffs I honestly wouldn't have had a huge issue with the hire in the grand scheme of things because we got something productive out of it in Rivers' development. Was Norv an ideal replacement for Marty? No. Does that change the fact that Marty's firing was quite warranted? Also and emphatically NO.
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.


Considering Norv A) Got farther than Marty ever did and B) once went 13-3.... Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
In most systems of math 14-2 is better than 13-3 no matter how many laughing heads are posted. My guess is MS's overall record there is considerably better than Norv's, too.

How many times is firing a coach who is 14-2 his last year a GOOD idea? mmmmm never.
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JammerHammer21


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.


Considering Norv A) Got farther than Marty ever did and B) once went 13-3.... Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing
In most systems of math 14-2 is better than 13-3 no matter how many laughing heads are posted. My guess is MS's overall record there is considerably better than Norv's, too.

How many times is firing a coach who is 14-2 his last year a GOOD idea? mmmmm never.


Well you'd be wrong again since Marty won 47 games and Norv 56. Laughing
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Bohlmann20 (On The 95 Cleveland Browns Staff) wrote:
Lombardi - Isn't that the guy the trophy is named after? If so, top 3 coach of all time.

#JDI
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ChicagoAl


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2013 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The LBC wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JammerHammer21 wrote:
ChicagoAl wrote:
JaguarCrazy2832 wrote:
I can understand why, but San Diego always seems to be snake-bitten, i guess that was a Norv thing though
When SD fired Schotenheimer it was over for it. One of the dumbest moves EVER.


Not if you know the situation...
It was immediately obvious to me that SD would never achieve anything close to Schotenheimer's record with its new coach. My belief was completely on the money.

It was an inconceivably stupid move on SD's part.

That's not even an argument. Your contention was that it was "over" for San Diego when they fired Marty. Now you're changing your stance to it was over when they hired Norv. Make up your mind. There is no change of mind. I had no objection to Norv and did not indicate that. When a coach is fired abruptly like that it is almost impossible for the next coach to improve on a 14-2 record. Did anyone really expect that?

But even in your amended contention you're horribly wrong, either that or you're just terrible at math. Last I checked 13-3 (the Chargers' 2009 season record) is only a one standard deviation from 14-2 (the best record under Marty). Considering that we don't calculate in terms of half-games, that's about as "close" as you're going to find without matching or beating the record. A difference of 7.7% could be considered "close" in some contexts, I suppose. It is the difference between an "A" and a "B" too.

Now, if you'd like to explore actual facts and look at the context of Marty's firing, I'm more than happy to indulge you. Marty ran himself out the door when he didn't get the extension he was demanding following that 14-2 season - largely because the owner and front office recognized Marty for what his role was that season: A rah-rah guy whose coordinators were doing all the leg-work for... coordinators who had both been hired away and whom he was failing to bring sufficient replacements for (attempted to hire his brother whose most recent body of work was the defense of a 3-win Lions team that ranked in the bottom quarter of the league and who had been Marty's DC in the year-prior-to-his-firing of every single one of his previous HC gigs). If it isn't one thing, it's another. But don't blame failure with the Lions on a coach. That place is the graveyard of coaches. Didn't Mariucci fail there, too?

I'm not going to argue that hiring Norv Turner was either smart nor particularly great. It did aid the development of Philip Rivers so I can't feel completely terrible about it - and had Norv been fired after the first or second year we failed to make the playoffs I honestly wouldn't have had a huge issue with the hire in the grand scheme of things because we got something productive out of it in Rivers' development. Was Norv an ideal replacement for Marty? No. Does that change the fact that Marty's firing was quite warranted? Also and emphatically NO.
My observations are from a totally disinterested perspective with no emotional attachment although I have always had a soft spot for the Chargers. I always liked their uniforms.

My first football memories are of Lance Alworth when he was at Arkansas then following his career when he went to the Chargers. He could easily play in today's NFL and excel.

I cannot imagine a team as known for offense over the years as the Chargers have been hiring a coach like Smith, either. That would blow my mind.
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