Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Underachieved season=Long offseason

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Pittsburgh Steelers
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
superbowlburgh7


Joined: 24 Dec 2012
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:09 pm    Post subject: Underachieved season=Long offseason Reply with quote

This wasn't a great year for the Steelers. The offense showed times of being unstoppable to completely lost and below average. The defense was slow in the beginning of the season and really picked it up late. Injuries killed this team's momentum all year as well as the turnovers on offense. We couldn't force a turnover on defense when it really mattered and when we did the offense usually just gave the ball right back. Todd Haley's play calling really perplexed me and Mike Tomlin's leadership in crucial moments make me question where this team is headed. It seems that the Rooney's forced Bruce Arians out of town so that the team could get back to "Steeler Football". That wasn't the case at all. Haley was supposed to balance the offense out. He didn't. He was supposed to bring back life in the running game. He didn't. Although Arians play calling was questioned at times, he had a great relationship with our franchise QB and helped us get to 2 superbowls, winning 1 and coming so close to a second(thanks to Mendenhall). In Haley's defense, he has kept Big Ben off the ground more, but has completely underutilized our wide receivers and what they bring to the table. I'm all about the run game and controlling the game with it, but I was fine with the way Big Ben was playing under Arians. We were winning and Big Ben was doing what he does best: being clutch. I feel like Todd Haley is taking that away with these atrocious screen passes and inside handoffs that go nowhere. I think that getting rid of Haley would be the best thing for the team because clearly going from a 12-4 season with numerous injuries to a 8-8(possibly 7-9) season with numerous injuries is the least from progressing. I think that Mike Tomlin stays because he has proven to be an excellent coach that still has that drive to win superbowls and lead this great franchise. As far as the defense goes, I hope that - LeBeau returns, but if he does retire, give the job to Keith Butler. The defense has to get younger and I believe that restructuring James Harrison's, Troy Polamalu's, and Brett Keisel's contracts would be for the best interest of the team. Signing Casey Hampton to a 1 year deal would be ok, but only if there are not any other options. Cut Ziggy Hood and Larry Foote(if he doesn't retire) and resign Keenan Lewis. I think that signing Michael Johnson(DE/OLB) from the bengals would be a good free agent move and drafting Dion Jordan(DE/OLB) out of Oregon would also be a push to get younger.
_________________
“We know that everybody's against you, and all we have is us. That's what makes this team so strong.” - Ben Roethlisberger
DIEHARD STEELERS FAN FOR LIFE!!!
Here We Go Steelers, Here We Go!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Leader O'Cola


Joined: 17 Jan 2012
Posts: 1761
Location: An hour or so west of Chicago
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nice avatar
Rolling Eyes
_________________
DIAF
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stillersenat


Moderator
Joined: 23 Mar 2007
Posts: 11019
Location: In over my head.
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leader O'Cola wrote:
nice avatar
Rolling Eyes


Yes. Please reduce the size of your avatar to 80X80. Forum rules.
_________________


CaptainParker wrote:

Bubby outplayed Elway in everything....
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 49729
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2012 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sig is way too big.

Since its hard to read that giant block of text, Ill break down what I can...

Quote:
This wasn't a great year for the Steelers. The offense showed times of being unstoppable to completely lost and below average. The defense was slow in the beginning of the season and really picked it up late. Injuries killed this team's momentum all year as well as the turnovers on offense. We couldn't force a turnover on defense when it really mattered and when we did the offense usually just gave the ball right back. Todd Haley's play calling really perplexed me and Mike Tomlin's leadership in crucial moments make me question where this team is headed. It seems that the Rooney's forced Bruce Arians out of town so that the team could get back to "Steeler Football". That wasn't the case at all. Haley was supposed to balance the offense out. He didn't. He was supposed to bring back life in the running game. He didn't. Although Arians play calling was questioned at times, he had a great relationship with our franchise QB and helped us get to 2 superbowls, winning 1 and coming so close to a second(thanks to Mendenhall).




Most of this is on point, but no one ever said they were bringing in Haley to get back to Steelers football. People just assumed that. We have a highly paid QB and great targets (not so much this year) at WR and TE (Heath was great, tho). I dont know the exact reason they got rid of Arians...no one outside of the FO knows that....my guess is they got sick of his horrible situational playcalling and letting Ben do whatever he wanted.

As for Ben's and Bruce's relationship....Bruce coddled him, and thats why Ben liked him so much. As for winning SBs under him....we won in spite of his horrible playcalling many times. Our elite defense bailed him out more times than I care to count.

Haley's offense focused on getting the ball out of Ben's hands quickly, and while they obviously wanted to get more balanced, we arent built to enforce our will or ram it down teams throats. Thats the only issue I had with Haley's playcalling....he tried to force the running game too often. But Bruce did too, at times. No choice really.

Quote:
In Haley's defense, he has kept Big Ben off the ground more, but has completely underutilized our wide receivers and what they bring to the table.


You mean the WRs that had trouble getting open all year and failed to make key catches even when given the opportunity?

Hard to utilize players that arent making plays when given the chance.

Quote:
I'm all about the run game and controlling the game with it, but I was fine with the way Big Ben was playing under Arians. We were winning and Big Ben was doing what he does best: being clutch.


We were winning...but the offense wasnt much better, if at all.

Ben hasnt been truly clutch in a few years, so you cant pin that on Haley. Last time I checked, before Ben got hurt, he was leading the league in 3rd down pass efficient. The injury is what threw him off.

Quote:
I feel like Todd Haley is taking that away with these atrocious screen passes and inside handoffs that go nowhere


No offense, but i have a hard time believing you really watched this offense play under Arians much if you are critcizing Haley for this.

Arians bubble screens were MUCH worse and called at worse times. As for the run...Arians did the same. Even if it wasnt working, you have to do it to keep defenses honest.

Quote:
I think that getting rid of Haley would be the best thing for the team because clearly going from a 12-4 season with numerous injuries to a 8-8(possibly 7-9) season with numerous injuries is the least from progressing.


Nonsense.

We werent as good as our record last year, and it showed in the playoffs.

The only difference between last year and this year is that last year we were on the winning side of those close games....and there is no ONE reason for that change. This team was a mess top to bottom with injuries and inconsistent play.

Quote:
I think that Mike Tomlin stays because he has proven to be an excellent coach that still has that drive to win superbowls and lead this great franchise. As far as the defense goes, I hope that - LeBeau returns, but if he does retire, give the job to Keith Butler.


You THINK Tomlin stays? We had three straight losing seasons (missing playoffs) under Cowher and we didnt fire him. Tomlin wasnt great this year, but there is no chance in hell he would be fired.

LeBeau....sadly, I think its time to go. Not because I dont want him, but because this defense needs to move on from him. We need to start drafting players under a new DC....instead of clinging on to LeBeau for a few years and draft players that a new DC might not want as much.

Quote:
The defense has to get younger and I believe that restructuring James Harrison's, Troy Polamalu's, and Brett Keisel's contracts would be for the best interest of the team. Signing Casey Hampton to a 1 year deal would be ok, but only if there are not any other options. Cut Ziggy Hood and Larry Foote(if he doesn't retire) and resign Keenan Lewis. I think that signing Michael Johnson(DE/OLB) from the bengals would be a good free agent move and drafting Dion Jordan(DE/OLB) out of Oregon would also be a push to get younger.


Defense needs to get younger, yes.

Cut Ziggy Hood? No. He isnt even making that much and can see be a good player if used right.

As for signing Michael Johnson....he is very inconistent and weak against the run. We have Jason Worlids for that. Johnson will get paid alot of money purely for his potentail as a pass rusher, but it shouldnt and wont be here. We needs our OLBs to be able to play the run and drop back into coverage. Thats not in his skillset. Chances are the Bengals resign him anyway as they have alot of money.
_________________
SCPackersFan wrote:
I hold nothing against blue-collar people and I respect/admire them for doing what they do.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
superbowlburgh7


Joined: 24 Dec 2012
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one said that, but it's obvious. IMO this offense is going nowhere with Haley. Bruce Arians wasn't the best play caller, but again when you help lead a team to one super bowl win and nearly a second(again thanks to Mendenhall lol) there isn't much to say or question. Winning is all that matters in this league and we won under him. Now Haley is in his first year and the injury to Big Ben surely had an impact on this season but I never felt the inconsistency with Arians like I do with Haley. Ben is a "backyard" QB. He plays with his feet and knowledge of the game. I have never seen anyone like Ben's instinct in this league and I personally feel that Haley's offense takes that away from him. Face it Ben is better when he can be Ben.

And obviously Arians didn't do that bad of a job with the running game because:
2007- Willie Parker(1316 yards)
2008- Who cares we won the Bowl Very Happy
2009- Mendenhall(1108 yards)
2010- Mendenhall(1273 yards)Made it to the Bowl, lost it because of Mendenhall
2011-Mendenhall(928 yards)
Cant complain under a coordinator with a 55-25 record in the regular season and a 5-3 playoff record.

And how can you say that we didn't underutilize Mike Wallace this season who, in 2009 averaged 19.1 yards a catch, in 2010 averaged 21.0 yards, and in 2011 averaged 16.6 compared to his 13.1 this year under Haley. I believe you are the one who didn't watch many games.

We lost the wildcard game in Denver because we had numerous injuries and because LeBeau basically handed them the game with the play he called in overtime. Wins are what matters and we made the playoffs last year, this year we didn't and like you pointed out the only difference is that we are on the losing side of the games this year. Partly because of Haley's readable offense that can't do anything when it really matters.

Oh and of course Mike Tomlin stays I worded that wrong.

All in all Go Steelers and happy Holidays to all Steeler Nation and a Happy New Year!
_________________
“We know that everybody's against you, and all we have is us. That's what makes this team so strong.” - Ben Roethlisberger
DIEHARD STEELERS FAN FOR LIFE!!!
Here We Go Steelers, Here We Go!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mason Storm


Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 476
Location: Hmm fire Tomlin of course y didnt i think of that oh yea because thats stupid.
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent points 43,

Sometimes me included you see a player on another team and you go we need that guy, then you get him and it's Deuce Staley all over again. I don't get all this hate for Tomlin only way he's on the hot seat is if they get beat 55-0. And maybe not even then the giants and Steelers show how it's done you hire the right guy and be patient.
_________________

^ TommyC376 sig n avy^
"You know your a parent when you pay $120 for your kid to watch something live thats on tv for free"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Gatoradus


Joined: 25 Jan 2010
Posts: 2216
Location: Virginia Beach, VA
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd rather that - Lebeau leave on a high note. No need for him to outwelcome himself. We have personnels to take over, so just retire, man.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
FourThreeMafia


Joined: 28 Sep 2006
Posts: 49729
Location: East of Sixburgh
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

superbowlburgh7 wrote:
No one said that, but it's obvious. IMO this offense is going nowhere with Haley.


Really....because it was clicking just fine until Ben got hurt.

Quote:
Bruce Arians wasn't the best play caller, but again when you help lead a team to one super bowl win and nearly a second(again thanks to Mendenhall lol) there isn't much to say or question.


He didnt help LEAD them. Thats the point youre missing. With that defense and Ben, he was in a golden position and just along for the ride. Now, Im not saying he didnt do ANY good for us, but any decent coach couldve enjoyed similar success.

Quote:
Winning is all that matters in this league and we won under him.


I always laugh at this kind of logic.

Quote:
Now Haley is in his first year and the injury to Big Ben surely had an impact on this season but I never felt the inconsistency with Arians like I do with Haley.


LMAO....yeah, Arians was the definition of consistency.


Quote:
Ben is a "backyard" QB. He plays with his feet and knowledge of the game. I have never seen anyone like Ben's instinct in this league and I personally feel that Haley's offense takes that away from him. Face it Ben is better when he can be Ben.


Once again, I find it hard to believe you even watched them if you say this.

Either that or you are just making blind statements.

Ben was allowed to be Ben all year...the only difference is the offense was more focused on quicker passes, which was something that was needed. It wasnt a vertical offense like Arians, but Arians would do stupid things like have long developing routes and 5 step drops for Ben even when he was getting killed.

And the offense was moving along fine until Ben got hurt. He was extremely efficient and still making plays with his feet.




Quote:
And obviously Arians didn't do that bad of a job with the running game because:
2007- Willie Parker(1316 yards)
2008- Who cares we won the Bowl Very Happy
2009- Mendenhall(1108 yards)
2010- Mendenhall(1273 yards)Made it to the Bowl, lost it because of Mendenhall
2011-Mendenhall(928 yards)

Cant complain under a coordinator with a 55-25 record in the regular season and a 5-3 playoff record.


2007 Willie Parker had Alan Faneca and Marvel Smith to run behind....two top tier run blockers.

2008...way to ignore a year that hurts your argument.

2009.... Healthy Mendenhall and line all year. Weak comparison.

2010....Healthy Mendenhall + ran it alot more

2011...Healthy Mendenhall and 928 is really nothing,

Poor comparisons. Mendenhall wasnt even 100% until mid season this year, and then we lost Ben for a few games, and then Mendy got hurt again, Mendenhall was healthy for a total of maybe 5 games this year.

But just keep ignoring those facts.

Quote:
And how can you say that we didn't underutilize Mike Wallace this season who, in 2009 averaged 19.1 yards a catch, in 2010 averaged 21.0 yards, and in 2011 averaged 16.6 compared to his 13.1 this year under Haley. I believe you are the one who didn't watch many games.


You mean the same Mike Wallace who failed to get open consistently, showed a lack of effort and care at many points and dropped about 10 balls this year?

I watched the games.

You just like to ignore.

Quote:
We lost the wildcard game in Denver because we had numerous injuries and because LeBeau basically handed them the game with the play he called in overtime.


LMAO...so you can dismiss all the injuries that hurt our offense this year and bash Haley, yet the injuries are a legit excuse for Bruce?

Yeah...your agenda is clear here. Im done debating this with someone who clearly doesnt even look at all the facts.


And I have no issue with you liking Arians more.....my issue is with your bashing of Haley and how you try to act like this one year was all a result of not having Bruce Arians ...which is beyond laughable.
_________________
SCPackersFan wrote:
I hold nothing against blue-collar people and I respect/admire them for doing what they do.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Mason Storm


Joined: 06 Aug 2009
Posts: 476
Location: Hmm fire Tomlin of course y didnt i think of that oh yea because thats stupid.
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Me and my family were elated they fired arians or whatever it is. It was like having a new baby all over again. Dancing
_________________

^ TommyC376 sig n avy^
"You know your a parent when you pay $120 for your kid to watch something live thats on tv for free"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
superbowlburgh7


Joined: 24 Dec 2012
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 4:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Im not ignoring facts. Im stating my opinion and your bashing me for MY OPINION. Yes, the offense was clicking before Ben got hurt. Im just saying that if you think that getting rid of Arians and saying that Haley has done better is ridiculous. You laugh at the logic of winning? It doesn't matter how you win. Winning is winning and now we are not in the playoffs looking into a long offseason. 8-8 possibly 7-9 is unacceptable regardless of the injuries when you make a change like that. Last time I checked, Arians has led a terrible Colts team from the year before with a rookie QB to a playoff berth. Their defense isn't any good either. What has Haley shown in any year that he's been a OC or HC that he is any good? And please don't say the year the Cardinals made the superbowl because Kurt Warner and Larry Fitzgerald got them their.
I would really like to see Haley succeed, he's the new OC and I have no control over it.

And I'm not sure why you keep saying that I don't watch the games. I haven't missed a game in years and go to multiple games each year. Seems kind of pathetic that you keep bringing that up.

Oh and I was talking about the defensive injuries during the Wildcard game not the injuries from the season overall.

But anyhow we are all apart of Steeler Nation and I'm not trying to argue with other fans. GO STEELERS!!

Who do you think we should keep as are main running back?
_________________
“We know that everybody's against you, and all we have is us. That's what makes this team so strong.” - Ben Roethlisberger
DIEHARD STEELERS FAN FOR LIFE!!!
Here We Go Steelers, Here We Go!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SteelProven


Moderator
Joined: 20 Apr 2005
Posts: 11893
Location: Ramstein, Germany
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The biggest issue with Arians is that he never took in porous OL play into consideration when drafting up game plans. He completely ignored the obvious and refused to alter his game plan for anybody or reason. Its not that Arians didn't have good plays he just didn't know how to manage a game or make adjustments when they were needed.

This year Haley has played to his teams strengths the biggest negative is that his WRs and RBs let him down. The Steelers WRs have 11 fumbles this year there isn't a OC that could survive that type of porous play from the teams biggest playmakers. Factor in the inconsistent play at WR, drop passes and the lackadaisical attitude in games and your going to have issues. I'm not making excuses for Haley either as he never truly help his OL by maintaining a committ to establishing a running game. Fans can discuss all day how the OL play was poor, but this line this year was head and shoulders ahead of any OL the Steelers have fielded in almost a decade. Now that's not saying much but with the rookies with playing time under their belts the ceiling for the OL is very high moving forward.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
superbowlburgh7


Joined: 24 Dec 2012
Posts: 9
PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2012 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SteelProven wrote:
The biggest issue with Arians is that he never took in porous OL play into consideration when drafting up game plans. He completely ignored the obvious and refused to alter his game plan for anybody or reason. Its not that Arians didn't have good plays he just didn't know how to manage a game or make adjustments when they were needed.

This year Haley has played to his teams strengths the biggest negative is that his WRs and RBs let him down. The Steelers WRs have 11 fumbles this year there isn't a OC that could survive that type of porous play from the teams biggest playmakers. Factor in the inconsistent play at WR, drop passes and the lackadaisical attitude in games and your going to have issues. I'm not making excuses for Haley either as he never truly help his OL by maintaining a committ to establishing a running game. Fans can discuss all day how the OL play was poor, but this line this year was head and shoulders ahead of any OL the Steelers have fielded in almost a decade. Now that's not saying much but with the rookies with playing time under their belts the ceiling for the OL is very high moving forward.

Yes I agree. The O-Line has looked much stronger and if we didn't have all the injuries and rotations at RB we for sure could of had a great running game. I hope Haley succeeds and hopefully Ben and him can mesh like him and Arians did.
_________________
“We know that everybody's against you, and all we have is us. That's what makes this team so strong.” - Ben Roethlisberger
DIEHARD STEELERS FAN FOR LIFE!!!
Here We Go Steelers, Here We Go!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
DudeWhat??


Joined: 01 Dec 2010
Posts: 924
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 12:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ziggy hood is so underrated...he is responsible for so many stops and tackles its not even funny..his position is a thankless position. I love how he ran that Running Back down a few weeks back..the RB had broke a big run..outrunning LB's, Cb's and Safeties...somehow ziggy catches him near the goalline..and the team has to settle for a field goal...Steelers offense then comes in..and go three and out..
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
The Curtain


Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 497
PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2012 9:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce Arians "just wins"??? Seriously? Because Andrew Luck has a billion turnovers this year, and the Colts pretty much are successful because of schedule and actual luck.

Guy has a couple of winning seasons on the back of a seriously elite defensive unit, plus a great QB, and then has a total fluke like this year in Indy, and he's lumped into "winner" territory. Please.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Pittsburgh Steelers All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group