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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
We want to fix the offence and the best way to do that before our defense retires is too hire the best offensive mind that we can.

Whether that is Dennison, Shanahan, Gruden Mini or Koetter we need the best offensive guy that we can get.

If we had to make his HC so be it.

The lowest risk way to fix the offence is to hire one of these guys to be the HC rather than another unproven play caller. At least we know the offense won't be ignored for another decade.


Again…you want to go all out to fix the offence a throw everything else out the window if we have to…I want a productive offence to go along with our top 5 D and for that you don't need an offensive guru...you just need someone who is solid at there job and I feel there are plenty of guys out there who can get that done.


If there are plenty of guys out there who can do it why don we have one?

Why have we not had one for all 9 years of Lovie's tenure?


Because we have hired the wrong guys…I have always said Lovie is a great coach…poor employer…I feel Emery should take control of the final say on staffing…but just because we haven’t had a good OC certainly doesn’t mean they aren’t out there.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 10086
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
We want to fix the offence and the best way to do that before our defense retires is too hire the best offensive mind that we can.

Whether that is Dennison, Shanahan, Gruden Mini or Koetter we need the best offensive guy that we can get.

If we had to make his HC so be it.

The lowest risk way to fix the offence is to hire one of these guys to be the HC rather than another unproven play caller. At least we know the offense won't be ignored for another decade.


Again…you want to go all out to fix the offence a throw everything else out the window if we have to…I want a productive offence to go along with our top 5 D and for that you don't need an offensive guru...you just need someone who is solid at there job and I feel there are plenty of guys out there who can get that done.


If there are plenty of guys out there who can do it why don we have one?

Why have we not had one for all 9 years of Lovie's tenure?


Because we have hired the wrong guys…I have always said Lovie is a great coach…poor employer…I feel Emery should take control of the final say on staffing…but just because we haven’t had a good OC certainly doesn’t mean they aren’t out there.



But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?
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ChicagoAl


Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Posts: 8018
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
We want to fix the offence and the best way to do that before our defense retires is too hire the best offensive mind that we can.

Whether that is Dennison, Shanahan, Gruden Mini or Koetter we need the best offensive guy that we can get.

If we had to make his HC so be it.

The lowest risk way to fix the offence is to hire one of these guys to be the HC rather than another unproven play caller. At least we know the offense won't be ignored for another decade.


Again…you want to go all out to fix the offence a throw everything else out the window if we have to…I want a productive offence to go along with our top 5 D and for that you don't need an offensive guru...you just need someone who is solid at there job and I feel there are plenty of guys out there who can get that done.


If there are plenty of guys out there who can do it why don we have one?

Why have we not had one for all 9 years of Lovie's tenure?


Because we have hired the wrong guys…I have always said Lovie is a great coach…poor employer…I feel Emery should take control of the final say on staffing…but just because we haven’t had a good OC certainly doesn’t mean they aren’t out there.



But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?
You are totally correct about that. We might get lucky and catch lightning in a bottle with some new unknown but that is not easy.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If a new OC signs with another team they get 3-4 years of security.

The Bears simply cannot offer that because Lovie is not successful enough to be given a long term extension.

We also have to admit that a first time guy might now want the pressure of rebuilding an offense with limited talent in 1 year. Not the best development conditions
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AZBearsFan


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
If a new OC signs with another team they get 3-4 years of security.

Like Jeremy Bates got in Seattle? Nothing is guaranteed. If you aren't succeeding you're on the bubble as a coordinator or position coach, even with a first year staff. Likewise, if an OC comes in and has a great offense but Lovie gets fired anyway they may stick with the next regime. It all comes down to results, and our offense is in a better position to succeed in 2013 than it was in 2010 when Martz was hired given the current skill position players.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 10086
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AZBearsFan wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
If a new OC signs with another team they get 3-4 years of security.

Like Jeremy Bates got in Seattle? Nothing is guaranteed. If you aren't succeeding you're on the bubble as a coordinator or position coach, even with a first year staff. Likewise, if an OC comes in and has a great offense but Lovie gets fired anyway they may stick with the next regime. It all comes down to results, and our offense is in a better position to succeed in 2013 than it was in 2010 when Martz was hired given the current skill position players.


And Jeremy Bates has not been an OC since. No one wants to fail in their first big shot and this is not the best circumstances to be successful.

Jeremy Bates still go a 3 year contract.

Even if we give a new OC a 3 year contract he cannot realistically expect he is going to get 3 years to develop and do the job.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 22959
Location: Scotland
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
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DaMike


Joined: 21 Nov 2010
Posts: 5669
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
I don't think he's a lame duck coach at all. I like Lovie. We really need a better OC though.
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Madmike90


Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Posts: 22959
Location: Scotland
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaMike wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
I don't think he's a lame duck coach at all. I like Lovie. We really need a better OC though.


Agreed.
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GOGRIESE


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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Location: Austin Texas
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaMike wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
I don't think he's a lame duck coach at all. I like Lovie. We really need a better OC though.


Great so your signing him to an extension after this season? Why do you think talks broke off when this losing streak started?
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DaMike


Joined: 21 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GOGRIESE wrote:
DaMike wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
I don't think he's a lame duck coach at all. I like Lovie. We really need a better OC though.


Great so your signing him to an extension after this season? Why do you think talks broke off when this losing streak started?
We don't even know if that's true.
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GOGRIESE


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Posts: 19368
Location: Austin Texas
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DaMike wrote:
GOGRIESE wrote:
DaMike wrote:
Madmike90 wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
But even if Emery hires them why would they come here?

-Lame duck coach
-HC who does not care about offense.
-Limited talent at OL and TE.

We has interviewed good candidates before (Chud) and they have turned us down.

If Lovie is back he offers one year of job security.

Why would LaFleur not take an OC job with one of the 8-9 other new head coaches where he would get 3 years is security?


If we had a good offence would Lovie be a “lame duck” coach? No…

What is the ambition of every coach in the NFL? To be an HC and run a team…working as an OC that doesn’t know much about offence is probably a team come true considering they would get to do things there way…

Every team looking for a new OC has limited talent somewhere…if they didn’t then the job would still be filled by the old OC…it’s Emery’s job to upgrade the talent on the Oline and TE and I believe he will do that…not only that the lack of talent there is outweighed by the talent of Cutler, Forte & Marshall.
I don't think he's a lame duck coach at all. I like Lovie. We really need a better OC though.


Great so your signing him to an extension after this season? Why do you think talks broke off when this losing streak started?
We don't even know if that's true.


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000111564/article/lovie-smith-bears-reportedly-not-in-contract-talks
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GOGRIESE


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sean Jensen was on the radio yesterday talking about Mike McCoy. He was raving about his football intelligence and saying that this guy is going to be a head coach one day. He got to meet him and was blown away by how knowledgeable he was.
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WindyCity


Joined: 26 Jun 2009
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GOGRIESE wrote:
Sean Jensen was on the radio yesterday talking about Mike McCoy. He was raving about his football intelligence and saying that this guy is going to be a head coach one day. He got to meet him and was blown away by how knowledgeable he was.


Great option and he just got better working with Manning.

He is a former college QB which should help him with developing and connecting to Cutler.
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AZBearsFan


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WindyCity wrote:
AZBearsFan wrote:
WindyCity wrote:
If a new OC signs with another team they get 3-4 years of security.

Like Jeremy Bates got in Seattle? Nothing is guaranteed. If you aren't succeeding you're on the bubble as a coordinator or position coach, even with a first year staff. Likewise, if an OC comes in and has a great offense but Lovie gets fired anyway they may stick with the next regime. It all comes down to results, and our offense is in a better position to succeed in 2013 than it was in 2010 when Martz was hired given the current skill position players.


And Jeremy Bates has not been an OC since. No one wants to fail in their first big shot and this is not the best circumstances to be successful.

Jeremy Bates still go a 3 year contract.

Even if we give a new OC a 3 year contract he cannot realistically expect he is going to get 3 years to develop and do the job.

Lovie's situation is unrelated to what defines the circumstances for success for an OC coming in. Lovie is almost completely hands off with the offense, plus Cutler/Marshall/Forte provide far more weapons to a new OC to BE successful than do the situations where most OC openings are anticipated to be. It isn't ideal in that the OL is trash but if the team was a well oiled machine on offense then there wouldn't be any reason to be looking at OC anyway. If a new OC were to come in under Lovie in 2013 in a "lame duck" season the OC can still prove himself worthy of either keeping the job in Chicago (not every coaching change leads to a wholesale staff firing) or, in the case of a top-to-bottom rebuild after 2013, prove himself competent to be hired elsewhere. These coaches don't cut their teeth stepping in unproven for Tom Brady - they usually step into less than perfect situations and make them better than they were. Any coach has to be able to see the potential we have here on offense, and while it isn't the ideal scenario (which rarely exist) it certainly provides a real opportunity to show what they can do with some elite talent.
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