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Around the NFL II: The 2012-13 Edition
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Thaiphoon


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Woz wrote:

(*) The one area where they've lagged behind colleges, high schools and Peewee leagues is in the area of concussions and helmet design. I think that kind of points to why they are making this a major point of emphasis now.
i don't think the NFL does much right in terms of safety for its players. IMO they handle it wrong.

1. you want a safer game- don't fine the hell out of them, especially with bills on monday after the game. They don't think about $ most of the time on the field. Suspend them or kick them out of the game if they have so many defenseless hits or helmet to helmet or something. That affects the team and their ability to work. That will make coaches get on them more and they will feel accountable for letting the team down.

2. Mandate they wear the safest equipment available, like you said. Helmets and other things NFL players don't wear the safest equipment because its not mandated by the league. They were supposed to mandate they wear thigh pads, yet I see most aren't. I think players are Nuts for not wearing hip pads, thigh pads and knee pads.


We agree here Turtle. I think both things should happen. I also think that the NFL should refine their rules and the game to make it as safe as it can be.

Remember that the NFL in its infancy was so violent that there were calls the ban the sport altogether. It took Roosevelt (I believe it was Teddy) getting involved to start getting the NFL to stop being a glorified gladiator battle without the actual lions. So the NFL has changed as the years have gone on to where we see it today. I'm sure if you pulled a player from back then, he would think this was a sissified version of the game he played. And yet, it is still a violent and wonderful game. Things can and will change over time Turtle. Its possible that kickoffs may be one of them in the future. Or its possible that how kickoffs are done is changed. Not sure, I just know that the NFL is taking steps to protect the long-term health of its players and any steps in that direction should be commended.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thaiphoon wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
Woz wrote:

(*) The one area where they've lagged behind colleges, high schools and Peewee leagues is in the area of concussions and helmet design. I think that kind of points to why they are making this a major point of emphasis now.
i don't think the NFL does much right in terms of safety for its players. IMO they handle it wrong.

1. you want a safer game- don't fine the hell out of them, especially with bills on monday after the game. They don't think about $ most of the time on the field. Suspend them or kick them out of the game if they have so many defenseless hits or helmet to helmet or something. That affects the team and their ability to work. That will make coaches get on them more and they will feel accountable for letting the team down.

2. Mandate they wear the safest equipment available, like you said. Helmets and other things NFL players don't wear the safest equipment because its not mandated by the league. They were supposed to mandate they wear thigh pads, yet I see most aren't. I think players are Nuts for not wearing hip pads, thigh pads and knee pads.


We agree here Turtle. I think both things should happen. I also think that the NFL should refine their rules and the game to make it as safe as it can be.

Remember that the NFL in its infancy was so violent that there were calls the ban the sport altogether. It took Roosevelt (I believe it was Teddy) getting involved to start getting the NFL to stop being a glorified gladiator battle without the actual lions. So the NFL has changed as the years have gone on to where we see it today. I'm sure if you pulled a player from back then, he would think this was a sissified version of the game he played. And yet, it is still a violent and wonderful game. Things can and will change over time Turtle. Its possible that kickoffs may be one of them in the future. Or its possible that how kickoffs are done is changed. Not sure, I just know that the NFL is taking steps to protect the long-term health of its players and any steps in that direction should be commended.
I'll be honest here. I think the NFL is tossing around this kick off rule because they don't want to be held liable for when players get really bad health problems later in life. They aren't willing to take care of long term liabilities of the players health.

That really makes me sad when an industry has the billions that it does but they won't provide the benefits for the retirees that they should. Instead of the league having to pay for their health bills, it gets tossed on us when retired players can't pay huge health bills. Everything gets passed on to us, everyday hard working Americans because the league want step up and take care of their own who made the game what it is today.

The industry should be required to do more for the the players that made them rich.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tagliabue has rescinded punishments against players in the New Orleans Saints bounty case, NFL spokesman Greg Aiello said Tuesday on Twitter.


Quote:
In issuing his decision, Tagliabue found that the conduct of the players -- Jonathan Vilma, Will Smith, Scott Fujita and Anthony Hargrove -- was detrimental to the league.

But "unlike Saints' broad organizational misconduct, player appeals involve sharply focused issues of alleged individual player misconduct in several different aspects," Tagliabue said in a statement released by the league. "My affirmation of Commissioner Goodell's findings could certainly justify the issuance of fines. However, this entire case has been contaminated by the coaches and others in the Saints' organization."



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Thaiphoon


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Thaiphoon wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
Woz wrote:

(*) The one area where they've lagged behind colleges, high schools and Peewee leagues is in the area of concussions and helmet design. I think that kind of points to why they are making this a major point of emphasis now.
i don't think the NFL does much right in terms of safety for its players. IMO they handle it wrong.

1. you want a safer game- don't fine the hell out of them, especially with bills on monday after the game. They don't think about $ most of the time on the field. Suspend them or kick them out of the game if they have so many defenseless hits or helmet to helmet or something. That affects the team and their ability to work. That will make coaches get on them more and they will feel accountable for letting the team down.

2. Mandate they wear the safest equipment available, like you said. Helmets and other things NFL players don't wear the safest equipment because its not mandated by the league. They were supposed to mandate they wear thigh pads, yet I see most aren't. I think players are Nuts for not wearing hip pads, thigh pads and knee pads.


We agree here Turtle. I think both things should happen. I also think that the NFL should refine their rules and the game to make it as safe as it can be.

Remember that the NFL in its infancy was so violent that there were calls the ban the sport altogether. It took Roosevelt (I believe it was Teddy) getting involved to start getting the NFL to stop being a glorified gladiator battle without the actual lions. So the NFL has changed as the years have gone on to where we see it today. I'm sure if you pulled a player from back then, he would think this was a sissified version of the game he played. And yet, it is still a violent and wonderful game. Things can and will change over time Turtle. Its possible that kickoffs may be one of them in the future. Or its possible that how kickoffs are done is changed. Not sure, I just know that the NFL is taking steps to protect the long-term health of its players and any steps in that direction should be commended.
I'll be honest here. I think the NFL is tossing around this kick off rule because they don't want to be held liable for when players get really bad health problems later in life. They aren't willing to take care of long term liabilities of the players health.
That really makes me sad when an industry has the billions that it does but they won't provide the benefits for the retirees that they should. Instead of the league having to pay for their health bills, it gets tossed on us when retired players can't pay huge health bills. Everything gets passed on to us, everyday hard working Americans because the league want step up and take care of their own who made the game what it is today.

The industry should be required to do more for the the players that made them rich.


Huh? You're against rule changes that could decrease the huge amount of concussions and your argument has been "they signed up for that risk". You cannot have it both ways Turtle.

It doesn't matter WHY the NFL is doing it. They are doing these rule changes in order to decrease the potentially life-altering/shortening injuries that can afflict former players years down the road.

I'm for player safety. And if the NFL (for whatever reason - be it financial, legal,etc...) adopts rule changes to eliminate kickoffs or change them completely in order to minimize the potential concussions and major injuries which occur each year then I'm all for it. Whatever the reason that is causing the NFL to be more proactive toward player health, the fact remains that by starting to put player health to the forefront, they are doing the players a huge favor (as well as themselves I agree).

I would think that someone who purports to be pro-player would applaud this rather than bash the league for doing it.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the Owners are doing it for their own financial reasons. Not for the safety of the players. Well I don't want the game changed either. The problem I see is the league still isn't doing enough for retirees.

Oh and it's just my opinion. I can have it that way if I wanna. Wink

Here is a story on the saints case:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/21362851/paul-tagliabue-used-different-logic-for-each-saints-bounty-punishment
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Thaiphoon


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
I think the Owners are doing it for their own financial reasons. Not for the safety of the players. Well I don't want the game changed either. The problem I see is the league still isn't doing enough for retirees.

Oh and it's just my opinion. I can have it that way if I wanna. Wink

Here is a story on the saints case:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/21362851/paul-tagliabue-used-different-logic-for-each-saints-bounty-punishment


Turtle, you said the following:

Quote:
"I think the Owners are doing it for their own financial reasons. Not for the safety of the players."


I think they are doing it for more than just financial reasons. However, even if you're right and its strictly from a financial origin, then this must be asked:

Who cares WHY the league is doing it?? If the end result is an increase in player safety, does it matter??


As for retirees, you'll note that the players themselves didn't want to do anything for them either. Both are beneficiaries of the players and owners which came before them. And yet, you cannot simply bash the league when the union didn't want to pony up any $$ for the retirees even though both the owners and players have benefitted from retirees.
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turtle28


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thaiphoon wrote:
turtle28 wrote:
I think the Owners are doing it for their own financial reasons. Not for the safety of the players. Well I don't want the game changed either. The problem I see is the league still isn't doing enough for retirees.

Oh and it's just my opinion. I can have it that way if I wanna. Wink

Here is a story on the saints case:

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/blog/eye-on-football/21362851/paul-tagliabue-used-different-logic-for-each-saints-bounty-punishment


Turtle, you said the following:

Quote:
"I think the Owners are doing it for their own financial reasons. Not for the safety of the players."


I think they are doing it for more than just financial reasons. However, even if you're right and its strictly from a financial origin, then this must be asked:

Who cares WHY the league is doing it?? If the end result is an increase in player safety, does it matter??


As for retirees, you'll note that the players themselves didn't want to do anything for them either. Both are beneficiaries of the players and owners which came before them. And yet, you cannot simply bash the league when the union didn't want to pony up any $$ for the retirees even though both the owners and players have benefitted from retirees.
i can if I want to and I will. Wink

Look we aren't going to agree. We know this. I'm extremely biased in these discussions. I definitely admit that. Laughing
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Woz


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

turtle28 wrote:
Woz wrote:

(*) The one area where they've lagged behind colleges, high schools and Peewee leagues is in the area of concussions and helmet design. I think that kind of points to why they are making this a major point of emphasis now.
i don't think the NFL does much right in terms of safety for its players. IMO they handle it wrong.

1. you want a safer game- don't fine the hell out of them, especially with bills on monday after the game. They don't think about $ most of the time on the field. Suspend them or kick them out of the game if they have so many defenseless hits or helmet to helmet or something. That affects the team and their ability to work. That will make coaches get on them more and they will feel accountable for letting the team down.


True, but the NFLPA will fight suspensions left and right (and they should since that's purpose). Fines can be levied without much push back.

Quote:
2. Mandate they wear the safest equipment available, like you said. Helmets and other things NFL players don't wear the safest equipment because its not mandated by the league. They were supposed to mandate they wear thigh pads, yet I see most aren't. I think players are Nuts for not wearing hip pads, thigh pads and knee pads.


The thigh pad thing I believe was challenged by the NFLPA. *shrugs* I'm with you on the equipment.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://m.usatoday.com/article/news/1723613

We all know that recently the league has gone to extreme measures to protect offensive players. They haven't done the same for defensive players, and those guys have spoken out about the hypocrisy.

Quote:
Sports Illustrated's Peter King reported Friday night that the league's competition committee will consider abolishing all blocks below the waist in 2013.
I hope they do it. It's is definitely hypocritical.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eagles get their wings clipped by the bengals! Laughing

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/2012/12/14/philadelphia-eagles-cincinnati-bengals-nfl/1768781/

Quote:
The Bengals scored 17 straight points off turnovers and were able to weather one of their worst games of the year to post a 34-13 win over the Eagles in the final Thursday Night game of the year.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@ Adam Shefter: Ravens do not plan to activate LB Ray Lewis by 4 pm and plan is to hold him out another week, via SalPal.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damn it steelers!!! Twisted Evil
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Thaiphoon


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 8:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That fumble on the return doomed the Steelers.

Seriously, the day was going so well.
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THESKINSFAN21


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thaiphoon wrote:
That fumble on the return doomed the Steelers.

Seriously, the day was going so well.

Agreed,although I do believe that is the only reason they won. Therefor cowboys still not looking legit. Wink
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 9:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

THESKINSFAN21 wrote:
Thaiphoon wrote:
That fumble on the return doomed the Steelers.

Seriously, the day was going so well.

Agreed,although I do believe that is the only reason they won. Therefor cowboys still not looking legit. Wink
steelers were playing starting their #5 cb. #1, 3, and 4 were injured! Shocked

Still though, you guys are right. Brown blew it in regulation, then in overtime Ben through the pass to Wallace too far to the inside. Easy int for Carr Twisted Evil
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