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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
Posts: 25175
Location: Ottawa
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2012 4:43 pm    Post subject: The world according to DHLF Reply with quote

I as well am disturbed with some of the recent coaching decisions.

In any sport, at critical times, you put the ball in the hands of your best players, or the players that give you the best chance to win. Usually those players are one in the same.

In the case of Detroit the offence is the better unit so one would think they give you the best chance. The Lions looked like they were going to blow the Colts out yesterday but then got conservative on offence and allowed the Colts back in the game. The Lions intercepted Luck three times yesterday and this game shouldn't have been close.

Suh and CJ had monster performances which were simply wasted.

People make mistakes but there is a theme of the coaching philosophy with the Lions. They play not to lose. They don't seem to play to win. In every broadcast it seems the commentators comment the Lions lack killer instinct. I would agree. At some point in every game the Lions get conservative on both sides of the ball and they snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

Now there will be some posters who will defend the coaches and players to the ends of the earth however a 4-8 record indicates there are problems/deficiencies within the Lions organization.

I am not an advocate of coaching changes at this time even though I'm disgruntled with some of the coaching decisions.

Gunther Cunningham. Week in and week out the defence seems to keep the Lions in games. The unit is obviously weak in the secondary but Gunther seems to maximize the units achievements given the lack of talent and injuries to the secondary. The only change I could accept would be if they could lure a certain defensive minded coach by the last name of Ryan into the fold.

Scott Linehan. Yes there have been times when the play calling has been questionable. Personally I'm frustrated late in the games when the team goes ultra conservative choosing to play a ball security game instead of letting Stafford air it out. The Lions running game isn't advanced to a level where there is much guarantee of achieving anything beyond two yards. I feel that beyond the late game decisions Linehan has done a relatively good job. Throughout the game the Lions need to run the ball. Failure to even attempt a running game simply allows the opposition to key on CJ and take him out of the game. It's also extremely important to continue the Linehan/Stafford relationship. Consistency in coaching is one of the most important keys to QB development and Stafford is still in the development stage of his career. I think Stafford and Linehan have to continue to build the relationship and although I'm not privy to details of the relationship I think the time has come where Linehan needs to seek his QB's advice. Stafford is the type of QB that wants the ball in key situations. Based on the last few weeks it doesn't appear Linehan wants to give it to him. Stafford is THE franchise QB in Detroit. Put the responsibility on his shoulders and let him win games.

Jim Schwartz. I was of mixed feelings when they went with a rookie head coach. He had a good résumé from his defensive coordinator past, but who knew how that would translate. His first actions were to bring in coordinators with head coaching histories. I applauded the move because it demonstrated to me that his ego wasn't going to get in the way of sound decision making. It was also a sign he had confidence in his own abilities and didn't feel threatened by bringing in high quality coordinators. More importantly it showed confidence while recognizing he could draw on his coordinators head coaching experience. My only knock on Schwartz has been his errors in judgement attributed to his temper and emotions. I love the emotion but not if it interferes with good judgement. In the final analysis Schwartz has to be held accountable for his errors but he also deserves credit for the positives. To date, as frustrated as I am with the Lions I see him as more positive than negative and when his relative inexperience is taken into consideration we, as fans, have to acknowledge he is still learning.

Martin Mayhew. I was angry when WCF named a Millen understudy to be GM but then a more refined look at Mayhew's past and Millen's ego revealed that perhaps Millen was the right guy after all. To date my main problem with Mayhew is the way he decided to build the team. I'm a fan that believes long term success is based on building a team inside outside front to back. In other words to acquire the talent to ave effective lines on both sides of the ball and then add linebackers, secondary and skill positions last. But that's just me and I recognize there is more than one way to accomplish a goal. During Mayhew's time here he has improved the talent level and acquired some strong building blocks that are legitimate stars in the league. He certainly hasn't been perfect but he has implemented his own candidate rating system by hiring the system developers. He has shown an ability to yield results from minor moves and he has shown a commitment to his system and developing all areas of the franchise. It's far to early to fire him and walk away from the best GM Detroit has had in decades.

Suh has drawn the ire of fans, the league, players and apparently the police. It's unfortunate but this young man has been squarely in the spot light since his days at Nebraska. He has caused many, including myself to shake my head with some of his antics but really in context his off field issues are totally related to driving infractions and even some of those have proven to be overblown. On field the kid just can't win. His only real crime has been THE STOMP. Last weeks kick was no more than a witch hunt and IMHO not even worthy of a fine. No one will ever convince me that off balance, falling Suh could accurately kick Schaub. I've taken some ferocious hockey hits as well as some frightening falls skiing and our limbs at that point react based on reflex, nothing more. The Cutler shove was a joke. There are far worse incidents weekly that don't even get mentioned by the NFL. When keying on Suh you see repeated, uncalled, flagrant fouls being committed against him. I have acquired tremendous respect for Suh based on his self control this season. What's being totally overlooked is Suh's self control with the media. He isn't being a sissy and running to the media every time he gets name called, insulted gouged etc. Those that don't think he is being subjected to those things has never played a team contact sport. The Lions organization is lucky to have him. He is a superstar talent who is disruptive on the majority of plays.

Pettigrew. Fans need to cut Pettigrew some slack. He has replaced Backus as the lightning rod amongst fans. Does he have drops? Yes,he certainly does. Last I checked the Lions lead the league in drops and every single receiver on the team is guilty. Pettigrew is routinely put in positions,by the play call as well as Stafford's occasional passes behind the play. Pettigrew more than any receiver on the team is placed in harms way. This kid is trying to catch a ball, most times, with immediate contact. Often with his body vulnerable while stretching to catch an off target pass. I played WR in football so I can't draw personal comparisons there. However I played centre in hockey and the offensive system we employed saw me placed directly in front of the net once we had possession in the attack zone or were established on the power play. Trying to make plays when you know as soon as you touch the ball you are going to be drilled is one of the toughest accomplishments in sport. Your body reacts instinctively to the contact and the level of concentration required to make the play is incredible. Now imagine Pettigrew who is operating over the middle and has to withstand that contact, often in a vulnerable position play after play. Some will draw comparisons to other tight ends but I don't know many teams that use the TE the way Detroit does. Most of today's valuable TE's are being used in similar fashion to a WR because of their size and speed.

Stafford. I have been critical of Stafford since his college days because of his inconsistency. I didn't want the Lions to draft him but came around based on popular opinion. If you review my comments on Mayhew you will also understand that the time of his selection during the rebuilding process doesn't fit with my thoughts on how you build a championship team. The most prevalent argument of the day was you have to draft a franchise QB when in the position to do so but as we have seen other teams have found ways to acquire the QB even though they weren't in the number one draft slot. I digress, this isn't about if Stafford was the correct choice. He was chosen. He is THE FRANCHISE, not just the QB. He continues to have struggles with touch and some times with accuracy not leading the receiver properly. He is showing year over year improvement. I find him to be frustrating because he has amazing arm strength and one play will throw a 60 yard rope that makes you shake your head in disbelief then throws a six yard swing pass to a running back at his shoe laces. IT DRIVES ME NUTS! When I'm being objective I believe he is a top 15 QB with potential to be elite. Based on potential I'm not sure there is a QB in the league I would rate above him. Based on game day performance (depends which game) not so much and there are a number of QB's I would prefer. The fact remains though he is young, developing and the offensive miscues are shared by everyone not just Stafford. Some of those are,
1. Play calling.
2. Drops.
3. Wrong routes.
4. Poor Blocking
5. Errant QB play
So his errors are front and centre but I and others have to be a bit more aware of the multiple reasons he looks bad at times. My one over riding concern is still drops. If one receiver was prone to drops that would be simple. It's the receiver. On the Lions every receiver is dropping the ball so in my view that's indicative of a QB having problems with touch. Now the touch issue is complex as well. Stafford makes many throws that are only possible because of his arm strength. To have any chance at success the ball has to get there in a hurry so velocity is what reduces the chance of interception. If I'm correct in may assessment drops are going to be a fact of life for the Lions. I also have to mind my manners during games. Stafford is my wife's favourite player and the last trip to Detroit I had to she'll out the cash for a New Jersey for her. So any criticism I level his way usually results in a tongue lashing followed by a night in the dog house.

Backus. Jeff Backus has been a warrior for the Detroit Lions having only missed one career start. This guy is the most under rated under appreciated player on the Lions. He is also one of the most under rated players in the league. Certain players give him matchup problems but that's true for every player in the league including CJ. He is nearing the end of his career because time waits for no one. Backus has chosen to stay with the Detroit Lions through the darkest times in Lions history. He showed up and has played through numerous injuries quietly and without complaint. You don't read many interviews but when Stafford was hurt he publicly admitted he felt responsible for the injury. Personally I would love a team full of players that display his level of class, responsibility, loyalty and commitment. If ever a player had grounds to give a franchise the finger and leave its Jeff Backus. But he didn't. He stayed. Many of you will disagree with me and that's fine but of all the current Lion players Jeff Backus along with Jason Hanson and Dom Raiola deserve our respect.

Dominic Raiola. Here is another player fans love to rag. Dom plays the game like a junkyard dog. He leaves it on the field every week. No one could ever accuse him of taking plays off. Yup, he gets beat by some of today's bigger more athletic tackles but most players at OC are having the same problems. Wandering through team threads shows most fans aren't very supportive of their centres level of play. The guy has been a starter here for a long time. Every year the Lions are in a position to draft his replacement but choose not to. Like Backus the time is drawing near for the DOG. He has played the position, which I feel is the most important position on the oline to the best of his ability. He isn't one to shy away from confrontation or controversy. He speaks his mind and once finished you never have to wonder what he meant.

Jason Hanson, Mr. Automatic. This week someone stated, " he's good just not clutch." I couldn't disagree more. One missed field goal does not define his career. After everything Hanson has given to the Lions and his loyalty to the team his career is beyond criticism. He has been as steady, as clutch and as important as any Lions player in my life time.

Avril. I was outspoken about not wanting the Lions to cough up the big cash after one season. I was wrong. He has faced some matchup problems this year, just as every other player has. He is quietly having another good season which puts his previous demands totally in line with performance. The Lions need to get this kid signed. Avril, Fairley, SLH, Suh and someone else are going to be mainstays on this defence for a long time.

Calvin Johnson. What can be said that hasn't already been said. He has been nagged by injuries all year. Has missed a great deal of practice time yet is quietly putting together one of the greatest seasons ever by a wide receiver. Combined with last years totals no one has ever posted back to back seasons like this. With the Lions sitting at 4-8 my only desire this year is to see CJ break Rice's yardage record. He deserves it. It's rare to see an individual with this level of talent remain 100% humble. He's the first to congratulate team mates after they make a play. I'm sure if asked CJ would say winning the last four games is more important than the record but as a fan I disagree. I want CJ to not only break but shatter the record and I truly hope the team feels the same way.

I have been a long suffering Lions fan. I'm 56 and there hasn't been much to cheer about over those years. As a boy I fell in love with the Lions largely because of the original fearsome foursome anchored by Alex Karras. Karras who recently passed on at age 77 was one of the greatest defensive tackles to ever play the game. His HOF snub continues to be ridiculous. I hope, " The Mad Duck," rests in peace.

Following Karras I had the privilege to watch the college and pro career of Billy Sims. Billy was the most talented running back I have ever seen. His love of the game and sheer tenacity was amazing. It's tough for those that simply look at stats to understand my view but for those of us that watched him play his on field performances are legendary. It's unfortunate he was forced from the game prematurely because I believe he would own the record book and be mentioned with Brown, Sanders and Payton as one of the greats.

What can be said about Barry Sanders. The greatest!

Chris Spielman remains my all time favourite Lion. He played the game the way it's supposed to be played and he looked to enjoy every snap.

Now we have CJ. So even through all the lean years there has always been something positive. It's usually been the team having a true superstar but today's roster offers so much more.

We are watching a player in CJ that if he plays long enough will most likely be regarded as the best in history.

We are watching Suh. A player I believe will supplant Karras as the best DT in franchise history.

We are watching Stafford who in my opinion is already the greatest QB in franchise history.

We have Avril, Fairley, Delmas, Pettigrew, Broyles, Levy all players that are improving and contributing.

There can be no doubt this has been a terrible season. Most of us have had our hearts ripped out and stomped on. But lets not lose sight of the positive and the building blocks in place on this roster.

As a result of this seasons let downs we have collectively, myself included been attacking each other and sometimes on a personal level. Lets not let our frustrations get the better of us. As Lions fans no one knows the heart break like we do. We have a great family here. We understand what it's like.

I have one single request. No one here owes me anything but if I could I would ask for some patience with the mocks that appear. Lets understand that no player is truly untouchable and some fans use mocks to express frustration. These mocks are simply the efforts of a single fan to post their views on how to better the Lions. Some of them represent a great deal of though and effort so lets be supportive and critique those mocks in a manner to be supportive and increase dialogue. Lets not be bully boys and take steps that hinder the sharing of thoughts.

Thanks

DHLF
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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boy oh boy. I thought this would get at least one negative comment. Or something.
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stylish313


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
Boy oh boy. I thought this would get at least one negative comment. Or something.
Gonna take awhile to read this, Lol.
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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stylish313 wrote:
diehardlionfan wrote:
Boy oh boy. I thought this would get at least one negative comment. Or something.
Gonna take awhile to read this, Lol.


Laughing ya think?

You can do it mang!
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stylish313


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Intriguing.
Well written.
Thought provoking.
Fair.
Touching.
Honest.

All words that come to mind after reading this post. Doesn't change my opinions though Laughing

I'm not satisfied with how Mayhew and the Lions brass have dealt with the success of last season. I disagree with how the Lions have dealt with many of their F/A's, including Houston, Avril, and SLH.

I'm not thrilled with Mayhew's lust for offensive skill positions, and lack of concern for the weakest areas on our roster.

With that said, much of what you've stated is probably felt by the majority of Lions fans including myself. This is our team, and we want to see everyone apart of the organization succeed. Reality hurts though, and after another disappointing season, I can't help but allow the negative thoughts and feelings creep in.
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SadLionFan00


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do truly believe there is hope for this team. Lots. People are giving up. But the fact of the matter is, when you have guys like CJ and Stafford on offense, you can compete in every game. Everyone else, and I mean EVERYONE, are compliment players. Our team revolves around CJ and Stafford. We are 4-8 this year, yes, but we have been in every game, and could very easily be in the playoff picture right now if some bounces had gone our way or we got a friendly call.

I dont see how anyone can not have hope after seeing the games vs. Houston, Green Bay, ect. Yes, heartbreaking, soul crushing losses. But you see that the Lions have the talent where it counts. They do lack the killer instinct. But, its a helluva lot easier to get that killer instinct than it is to get enough talent to compete (just ask the Browns, Raiders).

I do truly believe we need a new coaching staff. Only guy I would keep is Gunther (I love what he brings in terms of attitude). The rest can go as far as Im concerned. Jim Schwartz talks and acts tough, but he isnt. We can see it with the way he plays not to lose late. We need a HC who is calm, but isnt afraid to drive home the win, and not just try and wade towards it.

Im thinking about posting a "What I would do" mock, but I havent slept in 30 hours, and I have hw to do, and a meeting in a couple hours.

Ah, frack it.
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Silver&Black88 wrote:
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Trestman is a great coach but Cutler is already a pouty overconfident poo flinger. What more can he do with him?
Get him to fling poo more accurately and make better decisions when flinging it?
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diehardlionfan


Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SadLionFan00 wrote:
I do truly believe there is hope for this team. Lots. People are giving up. But the fact of the matter is, when you have guys like CJ and Stafford on offense, you can compete in every game. Everyone else, and I mean EVERYONE, are compliment players. Our team revolves around CJ and Stafford. We are 4-8 this year, yes, but we have been in every game, and could very easily be in the playoff picture right now if some bounces had gone our way or we got a friendly call.

I dont see how anyone can not have hope after seeing the games vs. Houston, Green Bay, ect. Yes, heartbreaking, soul crushing losses. But you see that the Lions have the talent where it counts. They do lack the killer instinct. But, its a helluva lot easier to get that killer instinct than it is to get enough talent to compete (just ask the Browns, Raiders).

I do truly believe we need a new coaching staff. Only guy I would keep is Gunther (I love what he brings in terms of attitude). The rest can go as far as Im concerned. Jim Schwartz talks and acts tough, but he isnt. We can see it with the way he plays not to lose late. We need a HC who is calm, but isnt afraid to drive home the win, and not just try and wade towards it.

Im thinking about posting a "What I would do" mock, but I havent slept in 30 hours, and I have hw to do, and a meeting in a couple hours.

Ah, frack it.


30 hours without sleep?

Oh, to be young again!
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SadLionFan00


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
SadLionFan00 wrote:
I do truly believe there is hope for this team. Lots. People are giving up. But the fact of the matter is, when you have guys like CJ and Stafford on offense, you can compete in every game. Everyone else, and I mean EVERYONE, are compliment players. Our team revolves around CJ and Stafford. We are 4-8 this year, yes, but we have been in every game, and could very easily be in the playoff picture right now if some bounces had gone our way or we got a friendly call.

I dont see how anyone can not have hope after seeing the games vs. Houston, Green Bay, ect. Yes, heartbreaking, soul crushing losses. But you see that the Lions have the talent where it counts. They do lack the killer instinct. But, its a helluva lot easier to get that killer instinct than it is to get enough talent to compete (just ask the Browns, Raiders).

I do truly believe we need a new coaching staff. Only guy I would keep is Gunther (I love what he brings in terms of attitude). The rest can go as far as Im concerned. Jim Schwartz talks and acts tough, but he isnt. We can see it with the way he plays not to lose late. We need a HC who is calm, but isnt afraid to drive home the win, and not just try and wade towards it.

Im thinking about posting a "What I would do" mock, but I havent slept in 30 hours, and I have hw to do, and a meeting in a couple hours.

Ah, frack it.


30 hours without sleep?

Oh, to be young again!


Im not a fan of it. I like to sleep.
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Silver&Black88 wrote:
Quote:
Trestman is a great coach but Cutler is already a pouty overconfident poo flinger. What more can he do with him?
Get him to fling poo more accurately and make better decisions when flinging it?
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lions1957


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well put my friend Applause , and thank you Smile . I do not have the patience to put all that in type Wink .
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stylish313 wrote:
Intriguing.
Well written.
Thought provoking.
Fair.
Touching.
Honest.

All words that come to mind after reading this post. Doesn't change my opinions though Laughing

I'm not satisfied with how Mayhew and the Lions brass have dealt with the success of last season. I disagree with how the Lions have dealt with many of their F/A's, including Houston, Avril, and SLH.

I'm not thrilled with Mayhew's lust for offensive skill positions, and lack of concern for the weakest areas on our roster.

With that said, much of what you've stated is probably felt by the majority of Lions fans including myself. This is our team, and we want to see everyone apart of the organization succeed. Reality hurts though, and after another disappointing season, I can't help but allow the negative thoughts and feelings creep in.



I didn't expect it would change opinions Cool

I'm not satisfied with certain aspects either. I'm just not ready to throw in the towel on Mayhew and company just yet.

The handling of our own players is a tricky business. Realistically they need to be signed a bit early in an attempt to keep salaries a bit below market. Sign them to early, to cheap they hold out for renegotiation. Miss the window and you're looking at tagging them. It's a tough thing to get right. I would have preferred they get Avril signed a season before they had to use the tag. I want SLH here but maybe he simply wants to test the market in hopes of getting a starting job elsewhere.

I think we agree on how a team should be built but future picks were almost guaranteed to be weapons after Stafford was selected. I really wanted to see the trenches built up first but if they were to have been using the rotating QB strategy the fans would have probably revolted. Personally I would have been fine if they went with a QB like Hill for a few years while they built up the entire defence and oline.

The three picks following Stafford that upset me the most at the time was Pettigrew, Best and Young. Especially Best. Drafting him was like playing catch with a hand grenade with a loose pin. You know it's coming out you just hope you get a couple more throws in Wink I know why they wanted him but he simply presented far, far to much risk. When Pettigrew was drafted I wanted to throw something at the T.V. It's history now and it is what it is. Young was another pick that represented to much risk and it bit the Lions squarely on the buttocks. Broyles I was happy with but that's simply because I know how good he was in college and I readily admit the homer side of me was fully on board.

With the coaches I'm not happy but I see more reasons to keep them than fire them. I'm most upset with Linehan but I think the organizations takes a risk with Staffords development if he gets let go now. The only coordinator I think would be worth the risk is if they could get Tommy Clements away from Green Bay and that isn't happening.

I guess what really bothers me the most with the organization is,

Brandon Pettigrew..........
Derrick Williams.............gone
Aaron Brown..................gone
Dan Gronkowski..............gone
Jahvid Best.....................probably done
Tim Toone......................gone
Titus Young.....................suspended
Mikel LeShoure................
Ryan Broyles...................injured

So, out of all those selections the Lions have three starters, with Broyles out for the year.

I haven't included any of the free agent signings or trades to acquire weapons. What makes this list worse is the amount of additional draft picks surrendered to move up and acquire certain players.
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detroitroar


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 8:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sheesh, seemed like an obituary. Sad

Really though, alot of good thoughts here most of which I agree.

I am still a bit emotional after losing 3 straight home games all in which we were the better team for the vast majority of. So whether or not I will stand by this, I dont know. But my feeling with this team is that it has been a complete and utter waste of talent due almost entirely to poor coaching. Be it a lack of discipline, in-game adjustments, in-game decisions, leadership, knowing the rules and giving teams free TD's, or whatever else.

With any bad team you can point to a number of reasons as to why, but if you watch these Lions week in and week out, I dont know how you can not see the poor positions or team is left in by the coaches CONSTANTLY.

I personally am fed up, and anxious to see what this team can do with a good staff.

Ive said this several times, continuity seems to mean less and less in todays NFL. First time HC's are coming in and taking the league by storm with young QB's. Talent and scheme supersede all else. We need to find the latter.
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tytalton


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good post dh - lots of solid thoughts and perspective from a loooong time fan. Lots of posters including myself don't have quite the experience of having been around during the Karras or even Kung-Fu Billy Sims years (although I was like 6 when Billy first started doing his thing)....

I agree whole heartedly about Suh. Nobody is going to give this guy a break. If he played for GB or the Giants there wouldn't be an issue whatsoever. Collinsworth and Espn would be taking the fight to the fans if he got that kind of bum wrap in a media hub town/NFL darling franchise.

I disagree about Pettigrew. The guys has shown he has some limitations with what he is being asked to do in this scheme and, though he has risen to the occasion often, this year has been a step backwards. Until last year I would agree with anyone that he has contributed more big plays than he has blown plays. After this year I think he has reversed that trend unfortunately. I don't know what you can do with him if he can't answer the bell consistently when you need him. If he lets you down half the time in situations where you are lucky to make the play only 50% of the time as it is; you need to try something different or bring someone else in.

I read you on MM as well but there aresome issues they have to address on their end and get better or change their system. I don't know if you can blame MM for this but their evaluation of WR talent has been in the toilet. I know they place alot of positional value on the position and, with the right players, we would look alot closer to 2011 than the current version. Bottom line is they are doing something wrong - either the scouts are not effective in evaluating WR's or their BLESTO system needs to incoporate some kind of measurement of uncertainty when it comes to receivers. They are flat out missing the mark on most of their receiver picks and that can't happen anymore. I'd almost prefer they do what Atlanta did and just shoot the moon on a WR and hope he works out. This death by 1000 cuts with all of these WR busts is killing me....
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tytalton wrote:
Good post dh - lots of solid thoughts and perspective from a loooong time fan. Lots of posters including myself don't have quite the experience of having been around during the Karras or even Kung-Fu Billy Sims years (although I was like 6 when Billy first started doing his thing)....

I agree whole heartedly about Suh. Nobody is going to give this guy a break. If he played for GB or the Giants there wouldn't be an issue whatsoever. Collinsworth and Espn would be taking the fight to the fans if he got that kind of bum wrap in a media hub town/NFL darling franchise.

I disagree about Pettigrew. The guys has shown he has some limitations with what he is being asked to do in this scheme and, though he has risen to the occasion often, this year has been a step backwards. Until last year I would agree with anyone that he has contributed more big plays than he has blown plays. After this year I think he has reversed that trend unfortunately. I don't know what you can do with him if he can't answer the bell consistently when you need him. If he lets you down half the time in situations where you are lucky to make the play only 50% of the time as it is; you need to try something different or bring someone else in.

I read you on MM as well but there aresome issues they have to address on their end and get better or change their system. I don't know if you can blame MM for this but their evaluation of WR talent has been in the toilet. I know they place alot of positional value on the position and, with the right players, we would look alot closer to 2011 than the current version. Bottom line is they are doing something wrong - either the scouts are not effective in evaluating WR's or their BLESTO system needs to incoporate some kind of measurement of uncertainty when it comes to receivers. They are flat out missing the mark on most of their receiver picks and that can't happen anymore. I'd almost prefer they do what Atlanta did and just shoot the moon on a WR and hope he works out. This death by 1000 cuts with all of these WR busts is killing me....


I hear you. Like I said to stylish. I don't like many of the things I see but so far I can rationalize it and say one more year.

I agree with what your saying about the receivers but it actually applies to all skill positions he has drafted. The only one I will reserve judgement on is the Broyles pick simply because he was coming on strong until Sunday.

I posted a list in response to Stylish. My biggest disappointment is the collective record drafting skill positions. It hurts doubly bad because they traded additional picks to move up for some of those players.

From my perspective they built the team in a way that I didn't believe was best. So you buy into the program recognizing there is more than one way to accomplish a task and they expend great resources on skill players that don't pan out. I didn't even list the free agent acquisitions and trades. A number of fans will argue those additional picks don't matter because very few pan out as starters. I would respond that they do matter if for nothing more than drafting ST talent. It's also irrelevant when the player you move up for busts.

Anyway, I certainly understand everyone's disapointment and frustration. About the only fan that saw a bad season coming was phreak. He predicted 6-10 a few others picked 8-8.
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diehardlionfan


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

detroitroar wrote:
Sheesh, seemed like an obituary. Sad

Really though, alot of good thoughts here most of which I agree.

I am still a bit emotional after losing 3 straight home games all in which we were the better team for the vast majority of. So whether or not I will stand by this, I dont know. But my feeling with this team is that it has been a complete and utter waste of talent due almost entirely to poor coaching. Be it a lack of discipline, in-game adjustments, in-game decisions, leadership, knowing the rules and giving teams free TD's, or whatever else.

With any bad team you can point to a number of reasons as to why, but if you watch these Lions week in and week out, I dont know how you can not see the poor positions or team is left in by the coaches CONSTANTLY.

I personally am fed up, and anxious to see what this team can do with a good staff.

Ive said this several times, continuity seems to mean less and less in todays NFL. First time HC's are coming in and taking the league by storm with young QB's. Talent and scheme supersede all else. We need to find the latter.


I can't disagree really. I just think the staff have to get one more year. The reality is they will get more they all signed extensions after last season.

I'm tired and I guess I'm missing something. Who are these rookie head coaches with young QB's taking the league by storm?
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2012 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

diehardlionfan wrote:
I guess what really bothers me the most with the organization is,

Brandon Pettigrew..........
Derrick Williams.............gone
Aaron Brown..................gone
Dan Gronkowski..............gone
Jahvid Best.....................probably done
Tim Toone......................gone
Titus Young.....................suspended
Mikel LeShoure................
Ryan Broyles...................injured

So, out of all those selections the Lions have three starters, with Broyles out for the year.

I haven't included any of the free agent signings or trades to acquire weapons. What makes this list worse is the amount of additional draft picks surrendered to move up and acquire certain players.

My thoughts on this section:

Of those picks, one is a 1st round selection. (And that player is currently a starter.) It's said that the 1st round has a 50% success rate, and that percentage declines for each round that follows. That list features one 6th round pick (Brown) and two 7th round picks (Gronkowski and Toone), positions that rarely yield contributors, let alone starters.

The worst picks of the Mayhew era have been Best and Young: Best's concussion history was well-documented, and Young had significant character concerns before the draft. His successful selections are plentiful, and the players acquired via draft-pick trades are impressive.

Mayhew deserves credit, in my opinion, as his decisions led to the creation of a competitive roster week in and week out. Considering what he started with, that's extremely impressive.
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