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SwiftTexan
Joined: 15 Feb 2011
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 Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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At a sports store today I saw some 15 jerseys in the new colours and I was like "sweet Doug Baldwin finally!" and then it turned out to be Flynn's - I don't wanna be one of those guys - I can't see Flynn sticking around next year so it'll be interesting to see what we do as a backup plan
His trade value could be hurt by teams willing to risk it on a fa rather than give up something in a trade - well see |
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Plush
Joined: 24 Sep 2012
Posts: 665
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| Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Sacks98 wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | If any team thought that Flynn was a franchise caliber QB, they wouldn't have let him sit on the market for so long and they wouldn't have allowed him to sign with us for so little.
I honestly do not care what your speculation is because it is almost entirely based on your opinion, which we've seen proven wrong on several accounts. I'm dealing with the facts of the matter. If any team valued Flynn as a 2nd round player last offseason (and there's no reason to think his value, without context, has risen) they would not have allowed him to sit on the market. I don't care if Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, and Aaron Rodgers were all free agents and you had the most amazing freaking draft class for QBs ever. No team would allow Flynn to get scooped up for borderline backup money.
Clearly you're just trying to be an optimist with his trade value. |
No. You're just not understanding. That is clear. Time changes things. Are you telling me that there are 3 clear franchise QB's in this draft, as there was thought to be in the last one? Look how many teams need immediate starters at QB. Jacksonville, Kansas City, New York Jets, and possibly teams like Arizona and Philadelphia could be looking to make changes at QB as well. You tell me which free agents or backups would be valued as high as Flynn? You know as well as I do, that need sets the market price in the NFL and there are a lot of teams in need of a QB. Last year, all the teams ahead of us filled their needs in the draft and free agency. The reason we were the only ones in the running for Flynn, was because we were the only team not in position to land Peyton Manning or one of the top 3 rookie QB's. Once Peyton signed, it was pretty much set that Indy, Washington and Miami would land Luck, RG3 and Tannenhill. They didn't need to make a play for Flynn. That's not my opinion, that's just common sense. It's not rocket science!  |
Geno Smith,Barkley and Collin Klein could fill some of those spots i am with SOS on this one i don't really see a supply and demand for Flynn otherwise we would have payed more for him last Off Season and not gotten him for such a good deal. |
Is this a joke? |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | I guess we'll find out when Flynn goes for less than a 2nd or 3rd+  |
In that case, I'd keep him, because we'd be giving up less than he was worth to us as an elite backup. |
Which is exactly what I already said.
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6523
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2012 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Sacks98 wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | If any team thought that Flynn was a franchise caliber QB, they wouldn't have let him sit on the market for so long and they wouldn't have allowed him to sign with us for so little.
I honestly do not care what your speculation is because it is almost entirely based on your opinion, which we've seen proven wrong on several accounts. I'm dealing with the facts of the matter. If any team valued Flynn as a 2nd round player last offseason (and there's no reason to think his value, without context, has risen) they would not have allowed him to sit on the market. I don't care if Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, and Aaron Rodgers were all free agents and you had the most amazing freaking draft class for QBs ever. No team would allow Flynn to get scooped up for borderline backup money.
Clearly you're just trying to be an optimist with his trade value. |
No. You're just not understanding. That is clear. Time changes things. Are you telling me that there are 3 clear franchise QB's in this draft, as there was thought to be in the last one? Look how many teams need immediate starters at QB. Jacksonville, Kansas City, New York Jets, and possibly teams like Arizona and Philadelphia could be looking to make changes at QB as well. You tell me which free agents or backups would be valued as high as Flynn? You know as well as I do, that need sets the market price in the NFL and there are a lot of teams in need of a QB. Last year, all the teams ahead of us filled their needs in the draft and free agency. The reason we were the only ones in the running for Flynn, was because we were the only team not in position to land Peyton Manning or one of the top 3 rookie QB's. Once Peyton signed, it was pretty much set that Indy, Washington and Miami would land Luck, RG3 and Tannenhill. They didn't need to make a play for Flynn. That's not my opinion, that's just common sense. It's not rocket science! |
Geno Smith,Barkley and Collin Klein could fill some of those spots i am with SOS on this one i don't really see a supply and demand for Flynn otherwise we would have payed more for him last Off Season and not gotten him for such a good deal. |
Hahahahahahaha . Colin Klein is the Tim Tebow of this draft. I think he's gonna be turned into a TE, somewhere in the mid to late rounds, because of his athleticism. |
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
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| Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn.
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Tatupu_64
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
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Location: Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. You killed my father. Prepare to die.
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| Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:40 pm Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
I don't see anything wrong with the idea. Sanchez is serviceable when he has capable players around him. We have that, the Jets don't.
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chpjns15
Joined: 21 Dec 2009
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| Posted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Tatupu_64 wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
I don't see anything wrong with the idea. Sanchez is serviceable when he has capable players around him. We have that, the Jets don't. |
Yeah, I wouldnt mind that. I think he would play much better without all of the pressure of NY. Then of course, I would also hope that he would never see the field.
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Tooki
Joined: 28 Apr 2009
Posts: 9546
Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:37 am Post subject: |
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| chpjns15 wrote: | | Tatupu_64 wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
I don't see anything wrong with the idea. Sanchez is serviceable when he has capable players around him. We have that, the Jets don't. |
Yeah, I wouldnt mind that. I think he would play much better without all of the pressure of NY. Then of course, I would also hope that he would never see the field. |
In all fairness, he has the criteria of a decent backup. Matt Flynn is a much better option, but he is also a valuable trade option.
Pete knows the Sanchize and how to make it work for him. Plus imagine the model photos that you could make out of Russell Wilson and Mark Sanchez! Sexiest QB tandem OHEMGEE
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:10 am Post subject: |
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| SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm. |
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SwiftTexan
Joined: 15 Feb 2011
Posts: 2420
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:15 am Post subject: |
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I thought about Sanchez as a back up too - I wouldn't be opposed to it but I wouldn't want him starting many games. I agree with osprey though, I'm inclined to believe that mark and petes relationship was fractured during the draft process - it just depends to what extent and how much that matters
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They're overrated & not making the Playoffs next season.
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imani
Joined: 03 Mar 2009
Posts: 21348
Location: Harlem, NY
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm. |
Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation.
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TheOsprey
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 6523
Location: In a van, down by the river.
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:53 pm Post subject: |
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| imani wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm. |
Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation. |
I still don't like him and I truly believe Flynn is a better passer. That hasn't changed. Yes, we have scored over 100 points combined the past 2 weeks, but in those games Wilson has only passed for a grand total of 348 yards and in those games combined, he has completed less than 60% of his passes. I know some people will say that he ran for 92 yards and 3 scores, but I'm "old school". Running the football is not his job. That is the job of the RB. Running backs run and Quarterbacks throw, so I don't count those. As far as I'm concerned, he took carries away from Lynch.
Looking further into those two huge victories, I give the vast majority of the credit to Marshawn Lynch and the defense/special teams. In those wins Lynch has totaled 241 rushing yards and 4 TD's and we've also tallied 4 defensive/special teams TD's. In my opinion, Wilson is getting way more credit than he deserves. Has he been a game manager who has done a good job of protecting the football? Yes, but I still see nothing that leads me to believe that he will be the dynamic passer who can lead us to a Superbowl. I truly believe with Flynn as a starter, we'd be a better team. Maybe I'm wrong, but you asked and that's my opinion. I know people will disagree, but that's nothing new. I just have to accept that this is the way it is. Wilson is the QB of this team, whether I like it or not.
Back to the original subject though, I still believe that Mike Vick, Alex Smith and Matt Flynn will be very hot commoditiesthis offseason. Given Vick's contract, injury issues an poor reputation and Smith's lack of a "wow factor", I still believe that Flynn's reasonable contract and the fact that he did play so well for the Packers, make him the best choice for most teams. Trading him now, when the demand will be high, just makes too much sense, since he's gonna be relegated to the bench, if he stays. |
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SupeRG00F
Joined: 12 Aug 2012
Posts: 983
Location: Vancouver, Wa
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 4:08 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | imani wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm. |
Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation. |
I still don't like him and I truly believe Flynn is a better passer. That hasn't changed. Yes, we have scored over 100 points combined the past 2 weeks, but in those games Wilson has only passed for a grand total of 348 yards and in those games combined, he has completed less than 60% of his passes. I know some people will say that he ran for 92 yards and 3 scores, but I'm "old school". Running the football is not his job. That is the job of the RB. Running backs run and Quarterbacks throw, so I don't count those. As far as I'm concerned, he took carries away from Lynch.
Looking further into those two huge victories, I give the vast majority of the credit to Marshawn Lynch and the defense/special teams. In those wins Lynch has totaled 241 rushing yards and 4 TD's and we've also tallied 4 defensive/special teams TD's. In my opinion, Wilson is getting way more credit than he deserves. Has he been a game manager who has done a good job of protecting the football? Yes, but I still see nothing that leads me to believe that he will be the dynamic passer who can lead us to a Superbowl. I truly believe with Flynn as a starter, we'd be a better team. Maybe I'm wrong, but you asked and that's my opinion. I know people will disagree, but that's nothing new. I just have to accept that this is the way it is. Wilson is the QB of this team, whether I like it or not.
Back to the original subject though, I still believe that Mike Vick, Alex Smith and Matt Flynn will be very hot commoditiesthis offseason. Given Vick's contract, injury issues an poor reputation and Smith's lack of a "wow factor", I still believe that Flynn's reasonable contract and the fact that he did play so well for the Packers, make him the best choice for most teams. Trading him now, when the demand will be high, just makes too much sense, since he's gonna be relegated to the bench, if he stays. |
Is there absolutley nothing that Wilson can do to prove to you he can throw with the best in the league?
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SupeRG00F
Joined: 12 Aug 2012
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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Besides grow.
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SaveourSonics
Joined: 20 Apr 2008
Posts: 45445
Location: Sleepless in Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:11 pm Post subject: |
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| TheOsprey wrote: | | imani wrote: | | TheOsprey wrote: | | SaveourSonics wrote: | Something I would actually like that may be really unpopular after last night.
If the Jets cut Mark Sanchez, I really wouldn't mind signing him as our backup and trading Matt Flynn. He'd be comfortable with Pete's scheme, he'd be fine in short doses, and there would be no pressure to see him play.
I think this would be the best backup QB scenario for us if we dealt Flynn. |
On top of the fact that I hate Sanchez and think he completely lacks any instincts and can't read defenses to save his life, I don't see this happening for a completely different reason. Back when Sanchez declared for the draft, it was reported on ESPN that Pete was not happy at all with Sanchez's decision. He felt Mark was nowhere near ready and tried to talk him out of it. According to what I saw on ESPN back then, it got a little tense and there were hard feelings that developed between the two men. If the report was right, Pete is not a big Sanchez fan. Personally, I'd rather trade Flynn and take a chance on a late round QB like Colby Cameron of La. Tech. I see some potential in this kid. He has a very strong, accurate arm. |
Soooo (not to be that guy), but when are you going to address this whole Russell WIlson thing. You gave us a REALLY hard time about it in training camp and preseason. I just want to hear your re-evaluation. |
I still don't like him and I truly believe Flynn is a better passer. That hasn't changed. Yes, we have scored over 100 points combined the past 2 weeks, but in those games Wilson has only passed for a grand total of 348 yards and in those games combined, he has completed less than 60% of his passes. I know some people will say that he ran for 92 yards and 3 scores, but I'm "old school". Running the football is not his job. That is the job of the RB. Running backs run and Quarterbacks throw, so I don't count those. As far as I'm concerned, he took carries away from Lynch.
Looking further into those two huge victories, I give the vast majority of the credit to Marshawn Lynch and the defense/special teams. In those wins Lynch has totaled 241 rushing yards and 4 TD's and we've also tallied 4 defensive/special teams TD's. In my opinion, Wilson is getting way more credit than he deserves. Has he been a game manager who has done a good job of protecting the football? Yes, but I still see nothing that leads me to believe that he will be the dynamic passer who can lead us to a Superbowl. I truly believe with Flynn as a starter, we'd be a better team. Maybe I'm wrong, but you asked and that's my opinion. I know people will disagree, but that's nothing new. I just have to accept that this is the way it is. Wilson is the QB of this team, whether I like it or not.
Back to the original subject though, I still believe that Mike Vick, Alex Smith and Matt Flynn will be very hot commoditiesthis offseason. Given Vick's contract, injury issues an poor reputation and Smith's lack of a "wow factor", I still believe that Flynn's reasonable contract and the fact that he did play so well for the Packers, make him the best choice for most teams. Trading him now, when the demand will be high, just makes too much sense, since he's gonna be relegated to the bench, if he stays. |
Okay, wow, so...
1. Wilson running to benefit the team and score doesn't satisfy you? I don't care if you are old school, the true old school way is to never even throw, so Wilson should be satisfying that. Wilson's read option is opening up A LOT of the big plays that Lynch is getting, which you're saying is carrying Wilson's performance. I'll take a TD whether it's through the air, on the ground, or in the water. Couldn't care less.
2. How about the fact that he has the highest single game QBR of ANY QB this season? How about the fact that he has the highest cumulative QBR since week 8 of ANY QB in the league. How about the fact that he owns the majority of the highest rookie QBR games this season? You're ignoring all of the facts, as usual, and only evaluating based off of your slanted opinion.
I have no problem admitting when I'm wrong, and I can say I was wrong thinking Flynn would be better than Wilson. Wilson is doing things that Flynn could never do. He's above and beyond anything I thought he'd be in his FIRST year, and you cannot concede your pride to just admit that he's playing better than you EVER thought he would. In the offseason you painted it as him having ZERO chance of succeeding in this league because of his height, and he's clearly succeeding now.
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