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Mercury22


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:27 am    Post subject: Benching Bush Reply with quote

I guess I'm kind of surprised there isn't more talk about this, but I'd like to know why Joe Philbin believed he had the luxury of benching Reggie Bush. Its not like Reggie was being careless with the ball when he fumbled, and its not like Reggie has had a fumble problem since Philbin has been coach (Bush has fumbled 3 times, but lost only two). Philbin sent our best play maker away in the off season. Now he is benching our 2nd best because of 2 fumbles in 9 games?

Daniel Thomas is averaging a full yard less per carry than Reggie Bush. Oh, and he just so happens to also have 2 fumbles on the season.

Beyond that, we are in a playoff hunt. We are not the kind of team that can afford to bench talented play makers in place of far less capable back ups. I realize we are a super long shot to make the playoffs (especially now) but that a very, very poor coaching decision if you ask me.
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dolphan9954


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I personally don't see what the big deal is. Reggie fumbled the ball, point blank. It wasn't that he fumbled on a big hit for me, it was a careless fumble. He had got the first down on a great run, and was running lose with the ball. That's all good and well but when you're being tackled secure the ball. I HATE fumbles more than anything. It's my number 1 pet peeve in football, to the point that even in a game of Madden I won't use a running back without a HIGH carry rating. It makes my blood boil. Cover the damn ball Reggie, Lamar, Daniel, Jorvorskie, Ryan. If you're running with the ball DONT DROP IT. Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad Evil or Very Mad
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Maddogg


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just a feeling but, I have the feeling that the coaches in practice last week went over and over about not fumbling and probably even during pregame speech put focus on securing the ball then Reggie Bush... DOH!
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SUG


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 8:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Philbin had been preaching to his offense all week that fumbles would not be tolerated.
Reggie fumbled & got benched, plain n simple.

Philbin has demonstrated that the rules apply to everyone equally.
You can't show favoritism to one player just cause he's a playmaker.

I like what I see from Philbin

sug
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phinmun


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wasn't Reggie's 1st fumble. He's put a few on the ground this year and handing it over when we were on our 25 wasn't good. It's his responsibility.

Besides, Miller got in the game a bunch.

Philbin also said he had planned to used all 3 RBs since he wanted to limit the carries given that the team was going to turn around and play again on Thursday.


So, as you can see there were a few reasons that Reggie didn't see more action.
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Mercury22


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
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phinmun


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.


So write him a letter.

He's going to bring a little accountability to a team that's still under-developed and irresponsible. You taking issue with that?

Fact: Bush is fumbling consistently now.

Fact: Our O-line makes Reggie Bush's ability a moot point.

Fact: We have a game we need our RBs healthy for Thursday (tomorrow).


Philbin "blew it."

No he benched Reggie Bush and Richie Incognito both and sent the team a message.

Fine. I don't care. I'd love to make the Play-Offs but that's a luxury we may have to sacrifice at the expense of developing accountability and discipline in Miami for once.
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fishfan4life


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
With the exception of maybe Hartline,Bush is the only guy on our team capable of making big plays it has been bothering me as well. I also didnt think bush got enough touches in the 2nd half of indy game. I am starting to see signs that his day is numbered here so it would be yet another guy who makes plays who will be gone. Frank gore here in SF has fumbled from time to time but he still gets the rock
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phinmun


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fishfan4life wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
With the exception of maybe Hartline,Bush is the only guy on our team capable of making big plays it has been bothering me as well. I also didnt think bush got enough touches in the 2nd half of indy game. I am starting to see signs that his day is numbered here so it would be yet another guy who makes plays who will be gone. Frank gore here in SF has fumbled from time to time but he still gets the rock


And they can run the ball.

We can't.


Having big play ability doesn't mean we hand it to him 30 times a game hoping that the Colts screw up and he goes 80 yards like he did against Oakland.

Philbin wants consistent, reliable runners and if Reggie is going to get bottled-up in the backfield and then turn the ball over for the 2nd or 3rd time in as many games when he does have a positive play...

...put it together.

If Thomas and Miller are the guys getting 2, 3 and 4 yards a pop then they need to be in the game so the play-caller (Mike Sherman) can do an adequate job of trying to march the team down the field.

Besides, Philbin held Thomas out of games. The only difference that Thomas supposedly was "recovering" from a concussion.

According to all the other teams who play their guys, it doesn't take 2 weeks to come back from a slight concussion. I would say this is Reggie Bush getting similar treatment. Rolling Eyes
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fishfan4life


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

phinmun wrote:
fishfan4life wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
With the exception of maybe Hartline,Bush is the only guy on our team capable of making big plays it has been bothering me as well. I also didnt think bush got enough touches in the 2nd half of indy game. I am starting to see signs that his day is numbered here so it would be yet another guy who makes plays who will be gone. Frank gore here in SF has fumbled from time to time but he still gets the rock


And they can run the ball.

We can't.


Having big play ability doesn't mean we hand it to him 30 times a game hoping that the Colts screw up and he goes 80 yards like he did against Oakland.


Philbin wants consistent, reliable runners and if Reggie is going to get bottled-up in the backfield and then turn the ball over for the 2nd or 3rd time in as many games when he does have a positive play...

...put it together.
They can run the ball because they have 3 1st round 0-lineman and 2 of them are first team all pro's. Doesnt change the fact that bush is only one of 2 guys on our entire team who can make a play. His yards per carry are solid and he has created big plays with averge line play. Look im not saying give him the rock 30 times but taking the ball out of his hands is not the answer. Are you saying daniel thomas is? HE FUMBLE AT THE SAME RATE and thats what philpin alternative is and has been.
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phinmun


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fishfan4life wrote:
phinmun wrote:
fishfan4life wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
With the exception of maybe Hartline,Bush is the only guy on our team capable of making big plays it has been bothering me as well. I also didnt think bush got enough touches in the 2nd half of indy game. I am starting to see signs that his day is numbered here so it would be yet another guy who makes plays who will be gone. Frank gore here in SF has fumbled from time to time but he still gets the rock


And they can run the ball.

We can't.


Having big play ability doesn't mean we hand it to him 30 times a game hoping that the Colts screw up and he goes 80 yards like he did against Oakland.


Philbin wants consistent, reliable runners and if Reggie is going to get bottled-up in the backfield and then turn the ball over for the 2nd or 3rd time in as many games when he does have a positive play...

...put it together.
They can run the ball because they have 3 1st round 0-lineman and 2 of them are first team all pro's. Doesnt change the fact that bush is only one of 2 guys on our entire team who can make a play. His yards per carry are solid and he has created big plays with averge line play. Look im not saying give him the rock 30 times but taking the ball out of his hands is not the answer. Are you saying daniel thomas is? HE FUMBLE AT THE SAME RATE and thats what philpin alternative is and has been.


He's sending a message to the team that starters like Bush and Incognito are as accountable as anyone. He wants smarter play out of both those guys primarily but also gets to make a point in front of his team which is going to mean something to the guys who have what it takes to stick around.

You guys are acting like he isn't allowed to do this because we're good and these games matter too much. This is a developmental year. Don't forget that. We are here to establish our new HC, our new QB, a new offensive system and to play tough in the process.

Stupid mistakes are the wrinkles we're trying to iron out.

Expect disciplinary actions to come when those are the issues we're trying to rise above this year.

It's not that big a deal especially if the team understands the message.


And you're welcome to tell me how many "big plays" Bush was going to pull out of his hat this week when it seems he's done nearly nothing in the last month.

Our O-line is making Bush and this topic a moot point. I said that already.
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Deadeye


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You're picking nits Merc.

Bush was not going to turn the Titan game around for us, we were going to lose no matter what RB did. And losing that game didn't cost us the playoffs, we were going to miss that no matter what. Please drop the fake sense of urgency.

Bush got back in the game, so who cares if he missed 1 or 1.5 quarters? I prefer Philbin not show favoritism to any one player, and benching Reggie might have helped to send that message to the team. But as far as Tannehill goes, do you honestly think Philbin should bench him after a couple of interceptions? That would be moronic. He's still very raw, but he's also improving and experience will get him where we want him to be faster than benching him will.

We aren't playing for the 2012 post season. We are playing for the 2013 and/or 2014 post season. Keep developing our key players and keep the culture change moving along.
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Mercury22


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deadeye wrote:
You're picking nits Merc.

Bush was not going to turn the Titan game around for us, we were going to lose no matter what RB did. And losing that game didn't cost us the playoffs, we were going to miss that no matter what. Please drop the fake sense of urgency.

Bush got back in the game, so who cares if he missed 1 or 1.5 quarters? I prefer Philbin not show favoritism to any one player, and benching Reggie might have helped to send that message to the team. But as far as Tannehill goes, do you honestly think Philbin should bench him after a couple of interceptions? That would be moronic. He's still very raw, but he's also improving and experience will get him where we want him to be faster than benching him will.

We aren't playing for the 2012 post season. We are playing for the 2013 and/or 2014 post season. Keep developing our key players and keep the culture change moving along.


Urgency? Where do you detect urgency? And no, I never said I thought Philbin should bech Tannehill. I said, if he was truly preaching ball security he would have benched him. Benching Bush was a dumb move. If Bush had been careless with the ball, then fine.

The constant defense of Joe Philbin in this forum is exhausting. Sometimes good coaches make bad calls. In this case, Philbin made a mistake. Bush did nothing to deserve benching. Philbin was trying to sling around his big stick and he did nothing to help the team win by putting in a clearly inferior Daniel Thomas who has just as many fumbles on a lot less carries.
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Mercury22


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

phinmun wrote:
fishfan4life wrote:
Mercury22 wrote:
If Philbin was preaching ball security then why didn't Tannehill get benched?


No, it was simply bad coaching. He took our most explosive weapon out of a game would could not afford to lose. If you want to preach ball security then do it consistently. Philbin blew it. Plain and simple. We lost all explosiveness on offense when Bush sat. Daniel Thomas and Lamar Miller are not Reggie Bush. Not even close.
With the exception of maybe Hartline,Bush is the only guy on our team capable of making big plays it has been bothering me as well. I also didnt think bush got enough touches in the 2nd half of indy game. I am starting to see signs that his day is numbered here so it would be yet another guy who makes plays who will be gone. Frank gore here in SF has fumbled from time to time but he still gets the rock


And they can run the ball.

We can't.



We can when Reggie Bush is carrying the ball. He is averaging 4.4 yards per carry this season. He averaged 5.0 yards per carry last year. That's beyond solid.

Thomas, by contrast, averages a pedestrian 3.4 yards per carry and has fumbled twice in about half the amount of carries that Bush has. Philbin played subpar talent to make point. A point he decided not to make when it came to his young QB. Its bad coaching.
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Miami2DaMax


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 14, 2012 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It wouldn't have hurt to throw him back in there on some plays but to not let him in at all, I bet the Titans DEF was jumping for joy and focused on taking out the pass, hence why we got destroyed.

I can't believe anyone would think it was a good call to bench him after a very good strip, careless my [inappropriate/removed].
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