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diehardlionfan
Joined: 12 Mar 2007
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Location: Ottawa
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 Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:34 pm Post subject: Stafford |
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We have just completed another game where the Lions offence decided to stay in the locker room for the first half. Stafford came out with accuracy issues and simply didn't lead this team.
The offensive woes aren't all Stafford's fault but as QB he needs to take charge of the offence and lead the team.
It's disappointing because he is a tremendous talent but it seems every week the lack of production puts the Lions behind early.
So, what's the issue. Why is the offence so unproductive in the first half?
His performance each week varies tremendously between the half s with significant differences in completion percentage, QBR, TD/INT ratio.
What are your thoughts?
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detfan782004
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better.
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Nnivolcm
Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 7453
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:44 pm Post subject: |
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| detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues.
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cibowilson
Joined: 12 Nov 2008
Posts: 1987
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Play calling, drops and penalties are the killers in the 1st half. We are supposed to be a vertical team yet we don't take a shot deep till late in the 3rd quarter. I don't get it. |
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detfan782004
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 47256
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him.
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Nnivolcm
Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 7453
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:50 pm Post subject: |
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| detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time.
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| George Carlin wrote: | | Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. |
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detfan782004
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 47256
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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| Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time. |
I have not seen them come out in no huddle or hurry up to start games. That is where he is a stud.
That is what I want to see.
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Sllim Pickens
Joined: 02 Jan 2007
Posts: 18719
Location: Middle of the Mitten
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:54 pm Post subject: |
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| detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time. |
I have not seen them come out in no huddle or hurry up to start games. That is where he is a stud.
That is what I want to see. |
Agreed. Or even going downfield a little. The problem is we sit and run screens and 5 yard out routes all first half. That's not getting Stafford comfortable. His comfort is gunning it down field, so stop the screens and open it up earlier.
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carlande
Joined: 21 Jan 2007
Posts: 1411
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Maybe gameplanning. They look clueless as to how to attack teams in the 1st quarter.
Going into games the Lions look out of synch and there's no rhythm. The second hald adjustments have worked well for this team though, and when the Lions are desparate in the 4th quarter the offense surprisingly plays well. The Philly game is the best example I think. Alot of that is the Lions having to play to their strength and defenses playing softer coverage at these points in the game though.
Specifically to the Vikings, I wouldn't discount how good the Vikings looked on defense in the 1st half. I remember a few plays where Stafford had alot of time to throw the ball and the Vikings DBs were just taking away all his reads. The Vilkings Defense played excellent in the 1st game and it seemed to carry over.
In terms of Stafford I don't know. Sorry. Practice, timing, quicker decisions, receivers have to get open. |
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detfan782004
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 47256
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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| Sllim Pickens wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time. |
I have not seen them come out in no huddle or hurry up to start games. That is where he is a stud.
That is what I want to see. |
Agreed. Or even going downfield a little. The problem is we sit and run screens and 5 yard out routes all first half. That's not getting Stafford comfortable. His comfort is gunning it down field, so stop the screens and open it up earlier. |
Exactly. The offense is putrid and predictable early. It gets in his head.
He is rattle then it takes two quarters to settle down.
Coaches need to fit their offense to their players not their players to their offense.
This is where Linehan fails.
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WillParks
Joined: 24 Feb 2009
Posts: 380
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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There isn't one problem with the offense, there are several:
1. We have to re-tool a good portion of our o-line. Raiola and Peterman aren't cutting it. We need to be able to control the line of scrimmage. If we had more talent on the o-line we would probably have fewer penalties.
2. Stafford has to grow up. He has to be a 4th-quarter QB for four quarters. How many times is Chad Greenway, a LB, going to pick him off?
3. The last 7 games should determine whether or not Linehan keeps his job. He isn't good at getting Stafford in a rythym and the play-calling in the first half is so-so at best.
4. The WR Coach, Shawn Jefferson, is popular with the players but our WRs under-perform as a group. They have trouble getting separation and have too many drops. Titus Young has regressed. We need a new position coach.
5. Stafford's position coach should be on the hot-seat also. Every QB needs a good position coach. Too bad we can't pry Bruce Arians away from the Colts. |
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detfan782004
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Posts: 47256
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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| WillParks wrote: | There isn't one problem with the offense, there are several:
1. We have to re-tool a good portion of our o-line. Raiola and Peterman aren't cutting it. We need to be able to control the line of scrimmage. If we had more talent on the o-line we would probably have fewer penalties.
2. Stafford has to grow up. He has to be a 4th-quarter QB for four quarters. How many times is Chad Greenway, a LB, going to pick him off?
3. The last 7 games should determine whether or not Linehan keeps his job. He isn't good at getting Stafford in a rythym and the play-calling in the first half is so-so at best.
4. The WR Coach, Shawn Jefferson, is popular with the players but our WRs under-perform as a group. They have trouble getting separation and have too many drops. Titus Young has regressed. We need a new position coach.
5. Stafford's position coach should be on the hot-seat also. Every QB needs a good position coach. Too bad we can't pry Bruce Arians away from the Colts. |
Not sure you can really blame the WR coach for lack of separation. Drops maybe but even that is tough.
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Nnivolcm
Joined: 07 Aug 2008
Posts: 7453
Location: Montana
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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| detfan782004 wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time. |
I have not seen them come out in no huddle or hurry up to start games. That is where he is a stud.
That is what I want to see. |
Agreed. Or even going downfield a little. The problem is we sit and run screens and 5 yard out routes all first half. That's not getting Stafford comfortable. His comfort is gunning it down field, so stop the screens and open it up earlier. |
Exactly. The offense is putrid and predictable early. It gets in his head.
He is rattle then it takes two quarters to settle down.
Coaches need to fit their offense to their players not their players to their offense.
This is where Linehan fails. |
There are routes called down field, Stafford just always takes the check down early or misses the target.
Can't really answer for the no huddle, except that I don't think it would be the answer to his early game problems, but I could be wrong.
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Team Stylish
Thanks to IDOG for the sig! |
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bdubs3316
Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 489
Location: East Coast
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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trade him the the Chiefs and select Geno or Barkley
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diehardlionfan
Joined: 12 Mar 2007
Posts: 24451
Location: Ottawa
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| Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Sllim Pickens wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | | Nnivolcm wrote: | | detfan782004 wrote: | Like I said in the GDT:
Linehan does not put Stafford in a position to succeed. His strength is really the hurry up no huddle offense.
If Stafford is shaky the coach needs to adjust. Get into a no huddle, keep defense on heels, let him get in a rhythm. After this you can go back to your play calls and he will execute better. |
Stafford has been in plenty of positions to succeed, and has failed to do so many times. Stafford is the prime example of what this team is about. He can play like a top 3 qb at times, but also like a bottom 10 qb at other times. I was really hoping this year he would be able to turn his slow starts around and be able to complete short swing passes and screens in the first quarter on a consistent basis, but that hasn't been the case.
He is only 24 and still shows the promise to one day be an elite qb, but he really needs to start faster and fix some ball placement issues. |
BUt that is my point. When defenses can sit back and be ready and rotate in at will it is easier to play Stafford. In order for him to start fast his confidence needs to start fast. This is done by not letting teams be ready for him. |
From what I've seen Linehan has tried to get Stafford's confidence up early by calling very easy to complete passes that are either dropped or poorly placed most of the time. |
I have not seen them come out in no huddle or hurry up to start games. That is where he is a stud.
That is what I want to see. |
Agreed. Or even going downfield a little. The problem is we sit and run screens and 5 yard out routes all first half. That's not getting Stafford comfortable. His comfort is gunning it down field, so stop the screens and open it up earlier. |
Exactly. The offense is putrid and predictable early. It gets in his head.
He is rattle then it takes two quarters to settle down.
Coaches need to fit their offense to their players not their players to their offense.
This is where Linehan fails. |
There are routes called down field, Stafford just always takes the check down early or misses the target.
Can't really answer for the no huddle, except that I don't think it would be the answer to his early game problems, but I could be wrong. |
In the Seattle game CJ was wide open downfield in the first half on numerous occasions but Stafford just didn't find him.
Detfan, I agree coaches need to fit schemes etc. to a players strengths but I just don't buy the hurry-up as a solution to increasing Stafford's effectiveness.
If he can't find a way to stop over throwing short routes the Lions have a problem.
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