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Ken Whisenhunt: Stay Or Go?
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The Fate of Whiz
Stay
60%
 60%  [ 18 ]
Go
40%
 40%  [ 12 ]
Total Votes : 30

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DirtyDez


Joined: 15 Oct 2010
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yibbyl wrote:
DirtyDez wrote:
It's still a better job. Chip isn't going to Buffalo...

Can't say one way or the other about the 2nd sentence, but I think the 1st is accurate. Not because of the players though, but because of the fact that Ralph Wilson is a couple of years older than ancient and there are some upcoming issues regarding the stadium. We're actually fighting a battle to keep the team in Buffalo and the likelihood of a new owner in the relatively near future is not out of the question. IMHO the turmoil those 2 things could cause is enough to compensate for KC's less-talented team, which does make Buffalo a less desirable job. Unfortunately.


I don't think Buffalo is more talented (they are on the DL)... Are they one of the teams that might go to LA?
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x0x


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The greatest head coach in modern Cardinals history?


I'd give him ten more years.



You guys don't seem to realize it's not easy getting a top QB when you're drafting in the middle and don't have the cap space.


Whiz made his move on Peyton. What else would you have him do?
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apollo14000


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

x0x wrote:
The greatest head coach in modern Cardinals history?


I'd give him ten more years.



You guys don't seem to realize it's not easy getting a top QB when you're drafting in the middle and don't have the cap space.


Whiz made his move on Peyton. What else would you have him do?


He had Leinart, Anderson, Skelton, Kolb, and none of those guys panned out. It is hard to get a QB but Whiz hasn't shown that he can develop that QB here either. Plus I'm more upset that we just seem to have a random offensive game plan on sundays. We can't keep having these long losing streaks either.

Having near .500 record is good for the Cardinals, historically speaking, but we need to raise our level of standards and stop accepting 8-8 as a good Cardinals season.
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DirtyDez


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

x0x wrote:
The greatest head coach in modern Cardinals history?


Mrs. stchamp please chime in...
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 11:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DirtyDez wrote:
x0x wrote:
The greatest head coach in modern Cardinals history?


Mrs. stchamp please chime in...


LOL, prettty much. I like Whiz, I think everybody here pretty much knows that but crowning him the greatest Cards coach in modern history is a rather dubious achievement. Congratulations, you're better than Joe Bugel, Buddy Ryan, Vince Tobin, Dave McGinnis and Denny Green. That's not exactly an all-world achievement.
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khodder


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

x0x wrote:
You guys don't seem to realize it's not easy getting a top QB when you're drafting in the middle and don't have the cap space.


That is the most important part of this;

Look at the drafts under Whis;

5th overall, we took Levi, probably could have taken Adrian Peterson, but QB was really not much of an option.

16th overall, we go with DRC, was good at the time (funnily enough I was heavily campaigning for Mendenhall, Flacco went two picks later, but we were a far from complete team and Kurt Warner was still out QB.

31st overall, Beanie Wells. I think most of us liked this pick at the time, saw it as good value. The next QB drafted was Pat White, and we still had Kurt and Matt.

26th overall, Dan Williams, again most of us really like this at the time, needed our big NT. The next two QB's drafted were Jimmy Clausen and Colt McCoy.

5th overall, Patrick Peterson, I think most of us loved and still love this selection. Locker/Gabbert/Ponder were the next three QB's taken, would you rather have one of those three than Kolb and Peterson? This is the only time that there is really much of a question, but they addressed QB anyway.

13th overall, Floyd was the pick, Weeden, Osweiler, Wilson were the next 3 QB's taken.

It is a really interesting and very salient point. Where have our missed opportunities with QB's really come. 2010 was a shocking year, but we were banking on our former first round pick in Leinart. We went after a big name in Kolb, we went after the big name in Peyton, but he decided elsewhere.

For me, QB is not the issue with Whis, though I disagree with how he handled Leinart (Not so much with Warner, but with the adjustments on his footwork, which really screwed him up completely). The offensive line is another matter.
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khodder


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

To add to the above if we look through the top QB's in the NFL now and then look at their draft position and year;

Peyton Manning, 1st overall, 1998
Tom Brady, 6th Round, 2000
Aaron Rodgers, 24th overall, 2005
Eli Manning, 1st overall, 2004
Philip Rivers, 4th overall, 2004
Ben Roethlisberger, 11th overall, 2004
Matt Ryan, 3rd overall, 2008
Drew Brees, 32nd overall, 2001
Joe Flacco, 18th overall, 2008

There are others, but the trend it clear and it is getting stronger as you get closer to the now. QB's in the past have slid a little, but they don't anymore, look at the last two drafts. 2010, 3 QB's in the top 12, 2011, two QB's in the top 3.

QB is such a highly drafted spot that if you want to complete elite prospect, you are going to need to be drafting in the top 5 top really have a shot at one.
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AZPSquared


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/267660100028751873

Please!!!
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Boise&cards Fan


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AZPSquared wrote:
https://twitter.com/AdamSchefter/status/267660100028751873

Please!!!


Don't see him leaving college until he wins it all.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't understand the obsession with Chip Kelly but to each their own I guess.

The pro-Chip Kelly's have no idea of what he'll do to this defense. Apparently all the progress we've made there means nothing.
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AZCardinalsFan


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
I don't understand the obsession with Chip Kelly but to each their own I guess.

The pro-Chip Kelly's have no idea of what he'll do to this defense. Apparently all the progress we've made there means nothing.


or he could keep Horton and let him do his thing with the defense?
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AZCardinalsFan wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
I don't understand the obsession with Chip Kelly but to each their own I guess.

The pro-Chip Kelly's have no idea of what he'll do to this defense. Apparently all the progress we've made there means nothing.


or he could keep Horton and let him do his thing with the defense?


Ya he can but will he? That's the question. He's got no ties to Ray Horton and no real experience with a 3-4 defense. If he wants his own guy running the defense and his own system, the system he's familiar with, any progress we could make with the offense but would offset but the HUGE backwards steps we'd be taking on defense. I do not want that. Thhose are my only 2 sticking points. A coach that will execute a set offensive philosophy and the 3-4 defense. If Chip Kelly doesn't totally buy into this defense, he's off my list.
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younggun1273


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chip Kelly to the Eagles makes a lot more sense than Arizona. Vick, Jackson, McCoy and Maclin are all great fits for what he wants to do in Philly. Floyd, Fitz, Wells and Kolb are not fits for what he is trying to do.
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stchamp98


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

younggun1273 wrote:
Chip Kelly to the Eagles makes a lot more sense than Arizona. Vick, Jackson, McCoy and Maclin are all great fits for what he wants to do in Philly. Floyd, Fitz, Wells and Kolb are not fits for what he is trying to do.


That's assuming of course that Vick returns to Philly.
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younggun1273


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

stchamp98 wrote:
younggun1273 wrote:
Chip Kelly to the Eagles makes a lot more sense than Arizona. Vick, Jackson, McCoy and Maclin are all great fits for what he wants to do in Philly. Floyd, Fitz, Wells and Kolb are not fits for what he is trying to do.


That's assuming of course that Vick returns to Philly.


If Chip was the coach there, Vick would have to return. He is way too good of a fit for what he is trying to do and if Vick is let go, it's not like he would have a better option to work with on the roster or on the market.
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