Discuss football with over 60,000 fans. Free Membership. Join now!

 FAQFAQ  RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

FootballsFuture.com Forum Index
FootballsFuture.com Home

Can We Contend With The QBs On This Roster?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Arizona Cardinals
View previous topic :: View next topic  

Can We Contend With The QBs On This Roster?
Yes
25%
 25%  [ 5 ]
No
65%
 65%  [ 13 ]
Whatever stchamp98 says, he's always right
10%
 10%  [ 2 ]
Total Votes : 20

Author Message
SuperFlyTNT


Joined: 07 Feb 2011
Posts: 447
Location: Seattle
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SFaithful97 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
LuckyNumber11 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
"I think Kolb (and the running game) will benefit greatly from better play in the trenches."

I disagree. A better offensive line isn't going to vastly improve Kevin Kolb's play as his biggest downfall is a lack of awareness inside the pocket. A better pocket doesn't make a player like Kolb better inside the pocket. That's something Kolb needs to work through himself, nothing we can do personnel wise will fix that for him.


How could it not? When you get 2 to 4 seconds for your progressions hes going to have to make a quick decision and he won't be able to have the same yardage he would if he he did get the time.


Just watch Kolb play. He's not taking 2-4 seconds (That's not an accurate timetable anway) and then being forced to move ONLY when the protection is shoddy, Kevin Kolb does on nearly every snap he takes regardless of protection. No offensive line changes that.

It's easy, just watch Kolb play.
Again though look at it this way. If you as the QB have no confidence in you OL, you start feeling pressure even when there is none. I think if he got the time to make his reads more consistently he would and can start to be better in that regard. Not to mention the second part of what I mentioned. It is extremely difficult for the best of QB's to make up for the worst running game in football. When your QB has the limitations of a guy like Kolb, it is only going to make it worse. If teams can play their nickle defense against your base package and not worry too much about getting gashed on the ground, it is much harder to pass the football.


I've got a question - how did Kolb look in Philly behind their line? I know that wasn't known as the best line in football when he played there - but it is clearly better than our line right now. That's also a different scheme though - but it's the only comparison we have. Did he also have the happy feet there in the pocket and the lack of awareness?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SFaithful97


Joined: 08 Mar 2007
Posts: 2975
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2012 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SuperFlyTNT wrote:
SFaithful97 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
LuckyNumber11 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
"I think Kolb (and the running game) will benefit greatly from better play in the trenches."

I disagree. A better offensive line isn't going to vastly improve Kevin Kolb's play as his biggest downfall is a lack of awareness inside the pocket. A better pocket doesn't make a player like Kolb better inside the pocket. That's something Kolb needs to work through himself, nothing we can do personnel wise will fix that for him.


How could it not? When you get 2 to 4 seconds for your progressions hes going to have to make a quick decision and he won't be able to have the same yardage he would if he he did get the time.


Just watch Kolb play. He's not taking 2-4 seconds (That's not an accurate timetable anway) and then being forced to move ONLY when the protection is shoddy, Kevin Kolb does on nearly every snap he takes regardless of protection. No offensive line changes that.

It's easy, just watch Kolb play.
Again though look at it this way. If you as the QB have no confidence in you OL, you start feeling pressure even when there is none. I think if he got the time to make his reads more consistently he would and can start to be better in that regard. Not to mention the second part of what I mentioned. It is extremely difficult for the best of QB's to make up for the worst running game in football. When your QB has the limitations of a guy like Kolb, it is only going to make it worse. If teams can play their nickle defense against your base package and not worry too much about getting gashed on the ground, it is much harder to pass the football.


I've got a question - how did Kolb look in Philly behind their line? I know that wasn't known as the best line in football when he played there - but it is clearly better than our line right now. That's also a different scheme though - but it's the only comparison we have. Did he also have the happy feet there in the pocket and the lack of awareness?
I honestly don't know, I didn't watch him there. I do know that he had very good stat lines for the few games he played (threw for over 400 yards a couple times I believe), but it is a small sample size. My opinion of Kolb is that he is a good enough QB to win any game as long as the offense doesn't live and die with him performing miracles. There are very few QB's in the league that would be performing at a high level with the Cards current offense IMO, and I think it is a bit unfair to base ones opinion of him off of this season.

If I got hit as hard and as often as he has been, I would have poor pocket presence too... even if I were a good NFL QB.
_________________

MAC DRE wrote:
I'd rather have young Wagner and Wright going forward than Willis and Bowman.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stchamp98


Most Valuable Poster (3rd Ballot)

Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 52980
Location: Havre, Montana
PostPosted: Fri Oct 26, 2012 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SFaithful97 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
LuckyNumber11 wrote:
stchamp98 wrote:
"I think Kolb (and the running game) will benefit greatly from better play in the trenches."

I disagree. A better offensive line isn't going to vastly improve Kevin Kolb's play as his biggest downfall is a lack of awareness inside the pocket. A better pocket doesn't make a player like Kolb better inside the pocket. That's something Kolb needs to work through himself, nothing we can do personnel wise will fix that for him.


How could it not? When you get 2 to 4 seconds for your progressions hes going to have to make a quick decision and he won't be able to have the same yardage he would if he he did get the time.


Just watch Kolb play. He's not taking 2-4 seconds (That's not an accurate timetable anway) and then being forced to move ONLY when the protection is shoddy, Kevin Kolb does on nearly every snap he takes regardless of protection. No offensive line changes that.

It's easy, just watch Kolb play.
Again though look at it this way. If you as the QB have no confidence in you OL, you start feeling pressure even when there is none. I think if he got the time to make his reads more consistently he would and can start to be better in that regard. Not to mention the second part of what I mentioned. It is extremely difficult for the best of QB's to make up for the worst running game in football. When your QB has the limitations of a guy like Kolb, it is only going to make it worse. If teams can play their nickle defense against your base package and not worry too much about getting gashed on the ground, it is much harder to pass the football.


He did before he got here. That's not an Arizona offensive line problem, much as people like to pin it on their favorite whipping boy. It's a Kevin Kolb problem.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyV


Joined: 04 Jan 2008
Posts: 2205
Location: Chicago, Illinois
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Sando, ESPN.com‏@espn_nfcwest

Surprise stat from Week 9: John Skelton 7-10 for 127 yards, one TD, 91.4 Total QBR against 5+ pass-rushers. @ESPNStatsInfo


Mike Sando, ESPN.com‏@espn_nfcwest

Not so good: Skelton 16-36 passing for 179 yards with one INT and 25.6 Total QBR against 4 or fewer pass rushers in Week 9. @ESPNStatsInfo

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
iRobot


Joined: 17 Nov 2011
Posts: 789
Location: Mesa, AZ
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That has almost always been John's problem. John is not afraid to dart a ball into 2-3 defenders where Kolb is a little more trigger shy in those situations.

If you rush 4 and drop the rest into coverage, John will force throws that really, by all means, aren't there.

I think if Kolb gets healthy, he isn't the long term solution, but with time in the pocket he makes more accurate throws and better decisions. Unfortunate for him is the fact that there is no way he is here next season without a drastic pay cut.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
stchamp98


Most Valuable Poster (3rd Ballot)

Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 52980
Location: Havre, Montana
PostPosted: Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iRobot wrote:
That has almost always been John's problem. John is not afraid to dart a ball into 2-3 defenders where Kolb is a little more trigger shy in those situations.

If you rush 4 and drop the rest into coverage, John will force throws that really, by all means, aren't there.

I think if Kolb gets healthy, he isn't the long term solution, but with time in the pocket he makes more accurate throws and better decisions. Unfortunate for him is the fact that there is no way he is here next season without a drastic pay cut.


Bolded: Case in point, the pick he threw yesterday. 2 guys there and Housler didn't have a beat on either of them. Skelton throws it anyway. With this offense, we can't stand to give away a single yard let alone a single possession. Skelton's been doing that at an alarming rate. TO in every game he's played this year.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   

Post new topic   Reply to topic    FootballsFuture.com Forum Index -> Arizona Cardinals All times are GMT - 4 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6
Page 6 of 6

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum




Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group