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Brady Vs Eli Manning
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Which qb would you want for a big game?
Brady
61%
 61%  [ 78 ]
Manning
38%
 38%  [ 49 ]
Total Votes : 127

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FirstDownFaulk


Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 4797
Location: New York
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KingofSTATS wrote:
FirstDownFaulk wrote:
KingofSTATS wrote:
That's a negative. You can't be considered a SB winner, until you win a SB. But if you win more than you lose, by simple definition you are a WINNER. Why are you attempting to change the definition of words?

While we're at it, you are also predicting the future to now?

Who's changing the definition of words ?? How can you be considered a winner on the same level as guys who have actually won Super Bowl's, when you haven't ??

Yeah, I'm a psychic, and I would bet my net worth that Philip Rivers will NEVER win a Super Bowl. I mean, he couldnt win with the greatest running back and tight end of all-time (by your accounts)....his window has closed.

Seriously, just give up on your crusade to prove to the world that Philip Rivers is so great. You're on an island all alone, and everyone is laughing. No one is going to drink your "chargerade"....he's not very good anymore.


You are attempting to change the definition of winning, by qualifying it and when you do, it ruins your argument because the past 7 years, Brady has not been a winner. If anything he has been the biggest "choker" in pro sports. Who else has lost 2 championships in pro sports the past 7 years without winning a championship in that span? Since you believe in choking and qualifying wins.

I hope you don't have alot of value in your net worth, cause you'll be broke before you know it.

Guess that means Brady will never ever win a SB again, since he couldn't do it with an 18-0 team. Without Crennel and Weis, he's just not a SB winning QB, unless he's leaning on the shoulders of strong defensive teams. Your logic is fun, so reckless and unstable, I love it.

1 down year after 3 elite seasons, is not a sign of regressing big guy. It's a fluke down year that everyone experiences. Simmer down big guy.

Brady is clearly the better quarterback than Eli and Rivers....so I'll take him and his HoF, arguably the greatest quarterback to ever play, career Laughing Laughing
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jrry32 wrote:
Tom Brady hasn't left NE and proven himself not to be a system QB...so he is one.

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DarrellGreen28


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The more I think about it, the more I want to take Eli. Brady's gotta have nightmares of Manning Jr. sometimes
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Pats#1


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DarrellGreen28 wrote:
The more I think about it, the more I want to take Eli. Brady's gotta have nightmares of Manning Jr. sometimes


Of Eli...not at all


Of the Giants D line...without a doubt
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iPwn


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2012 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

E-Man wrote:
iPwn wrote:
How is a guy that plays in several systems throughout his career the definition of a system QB? They have changed the system so often to better accommodate the revolving door of talent around Brady, and he continues to thrive despite that. A system QB is one that can only be successful in one type of system (like Jeff Garcia in the WCO). Brady is the furthest thing from that, as proven by your admission that the offense continues to evolve.


key word: accommodate.

that describes it perfectly...

the Pats have to accommodate him.

he's still a system QB...just the master of many...which is why he is a good QB.


I said accommodate the talent aroun him, not accomodate him. It would be beyond stupid if the Patriots were trying to run the exact same offense with Gronk and Hernandez that they did with Moss. It would have been stupid if they didn't adjust the offense that was was designed for Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel in 06 to better take advantage of Randy Moss and Wes Welker in 07.

How are you even trying to make this a knock on him? You put any players in any offense that those players are used to, and Brady is going to be effective. That is exactly what you want in a QB, to be able to adapt his game to the players aroun him and still be great. This means that the Patriots can sign or draft any player they want and not worry about how his talent fits into what they try to do, because they can adjust the system (or completely change it) to use those players without fear that their QB won't be able to master it. I cannot for the life of me understand why you would call him a mirage and suggest that these changes have been made to make things easier for him.
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FirstDownFaulk


Joined: 25 Jul 2010
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

iPwn wrote:
E-Man wrote:
iPwn wrote:
How is a guy that plays in several systems throughout his career the definition of a system QB? They have changed the system so often to better accommodate the revolving door of talent around Brady, and he continues to thrive despite that. A system QB is one that can only be successful in one type of system (like Jeff Garcia in the WCO). Brady is the furthest thing from that, as proven by your admission that the offense continues to evolve.


key word: accommodate.

that describes it perfectly...

the Pats have to accommodate him.

he's still a system QB...just the master of many...which is why he is a good QB.


I said accommodate the talent aroun him, not accomodate him. It would be beyond stupid if the Patriots were trying to run the exact same offense with Gronk and Hernandez that they did with Moss. It would have been stupid if they didn't adjust the offense that was was designed for Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel in 06 to better take advantage of Randy Moss and Wes Welker in 07.

How are you even trying to make this a knock on him? You put any players in any offense that those players are used to, and Brady is going to be effective. That is exactly what you want in a QB, to be able to adapt his game to the players aroun him and still be great. This means that the Patriots can sign or draft any player they want and not worry about how his talent fits into what they try to do, because they can adjust the system (or completely change it) to use those players without fear that their QB won't be able to master it. I cannot for the life of me understand why you would call him a mirage and suggest that these changes have been made to make things easier for him.

This is what most of the "Brady Haters" are either incapable of realizing or simply refusing to realize. They cling to the "system quarterback" argument without realizing that he's played in FIVE different systems in his 10+ seasons. The proof is there for everyone to see, even those who refuse to, and it's that he is the system. Of course they "accommodate" their quarterback, it would be foolish not to. People continue to say this like it's a bad thing, but if you want to succeed as an organization you'll have a system in place that accentuates your signal callers strengths.

It amazes me that people still try to spin this as a bad thing and use it to discredit the guy in comparisons. If you prefer Eli and his propensity to throw an interception once every 30 attempts (Brady is every 48 attempts), then you can have him. I'll play the percentages and go with the guy who puts it in the end zone more often (Brady once every 17 attempts, Eli once every 21 attempts) over the guy who puts it into the hands of his opponents much more often.

If anyone is a "system quarterback" in this debate...it's Eli. He's had the luxury of playing under the same coordinator, Kevin Gilbride, since 2006.
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jrry32 wrote:
Tom Brady hasn't left NE and proven himself not to be a system QB...so he is one.

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reckless123


Joined: 02 Jun 2011
Posts: 10199
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FirstDownFaulk wrote:
iPwn wrote:
E-Man wrote:
iPwn wrote:
How is a guy that plays in several systems throughout his career the definition of a system QB? They have changed the system so often to better accommodate the revolving door of talent around Brady, and he continues to thrive despite that. A system QB is one that can only be successful in one type of system (like Jeff Garcia in the WCO). Brady is the furthest thing from that, as proven by your admission that the offense continues to evolve.


key word: accommodate.

that describes it perfectly...

the Pats have to accommodate him.

he's still a system QB...just the master of many...which is why he is a good QB.


I said accommodate the talent aroun him, not accomodate him. It would be beyond stupid if the Patriots were trying to run the exact same offense with Gronk and Hernandez that they did with Moss. It would have been stupid if they didn't adjust the offense that was was designed for Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel in 06 to better take advantage of Randy Moss and Wes Welker in 07.

How are you even trying to make this a knock on him? You put any players in any offense that those players are used to, and Brady is going to be effective. That is exactly what you want in a QB, to be able to adapt his game to the players aroun him and still be great. This means that the Patriots can sign or draft any player they want and not worry about how his talent fits into what they try to do, because they can adjust the system (or completely change it) to use those players without fear that their QB won't be able to master it. I cannot for the life of me understand why you would call him a mirage and suggest that these changes have been made to make things easier for him.

This is what most of the "Brady Haters" are either incapable of realizing or simply refusing to realize. They cling to the "system quarterback" argument without realizing that he's played in FIVE different systems in his 10+ seasons. The proof is there for everyone to see, even those who refuse to, and it's that he is the system. Of course they "accommodate" their quarterback, it would be foolish not to. People continue to say this like it's a bad thing, but if you want to succeed as an organization you'll have a system in place that accentuates your signal callers strengths.

It amazes me that people still try to spin this as a bad thing and use it to discredit the guy in comparisons. If you prefer Eli and his propensity to throw an interception once every 30 attempts (Brady is every 48 attempts), then you can have him. I'll play the percentages and go with the guy who puts it in the end zone more often (Brady once every 17 attempts, Eli once every 21 attempts) over the guy who puts it into the hands of his opponents much more often.

If anyone is a "system quarterback" in this debate...it's Eli. He's had the luxury of playing under the same coordinator, Kevin Gilbride, since 2006.


Are you really calling Eli a system QB? Eli would flourish in any system. Have we really got to the point where if you stay in one system then your a system QB.
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FirstDownFaulk


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 5:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

reckless123 wrote:
FirstDownFaulk wrote:
iPwn wrote:
E-Man wrote:
iPwn wrote:
How is a guy that plays in several systems throughout his career the definition of a system QB? They have changed the system so often to better accommodate the revolving door of talent around Brady, and he continues to thrive despite that. A system QB is one that can only be successful in one type of system (like Jeff Garcia in the WCO). Brady is the furthest thing from that, as proven by your admission that the offense continues to evolve.


key word: accommodate.

that describes it perfectly...

the Pats have to accommodate him.

he's still a system QB...just the master of many...which is why he is a good QB.


I said accommodate the talent aroun him, not accomodate him. It would be beyond stupid if the Patriots were trying to run the exact same offense with Gronk and Hernandez that they did with Moss. It would have been stupid if they didn't adjust the offense that was was designed for Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel in 06 to better take advantage of Randy Moss and Wes Welker in 07.

How are you even trying to make this a knock on him? You put any players in any offense that those players are used to, and Brady is going to be effective. That is exactly what you want in a QB, to be able to adapt his game to the players aroun him and still be great. This means that the Patriots can sign or draft any player they want and not worry about how his talent fits into what they try to do, because they can adjust the system (or completely change it) to use those players without fear that their QB won't be able to master it. I cannot for the life of me understand why you would call him a mirage and suggest that these changes have been made to make things easier for him.

This is what most of the "Brady Haters" are either incapable of realizing or simply refusing to realize. They cling to the "system quarterback" argument without realizing that he's played in FIVE different systems in his 10+ seasons. The proof is there for everyone to see, even those who refuse to, and it's that he is the system. Of course they "accommodate" their quarterback, it would be foolish not to. People continue to say this like it's a bad thing, but if you want to succeed as an organization you'll have a system in place that accentuates your signal callers strengths.

It amazes me that people still try to spin this as a bad thing and use it to discredit the guy in comparisons. If you prefer Eli and his propensity to throw an interception once every 30 attempts (Brady is every 48 attempts), then you can have him. I'll play the percentages and go with the guy who puts it in the end zone more often (Brady once every 17 attempts, Eli once every 21 attempts) over the guy who puts it into the hands of his opponents much more often.

If anyone is a "system quarterback" in this debate...it's Eli. He's had the luxury of playing under the same coordinator, Kevin Gilbride, since 2006.


Are you really calling Eli a system QB? Eli would flourish in any system. Have we really got to the point where if you stay in one system then your a system QB.

In a thread comparing Brady vs. Eli with people calling Brady a "system quarterback"....yeah, I'd day that "title" fits Eli better than it does Brady, considering the factors surrounding them both.

You think Eli would "flourish" in any system, but how about Brady ?? Yay for subjective reasoning as a basis for making a point!
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jrry32 wrote:
Tom Brady hasn't left NE and proven himself not to be a system QB...so he is one.

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BroncoinGermany


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DarrellGreen28 wrote:
If I had to pick one of them and play a team who had the other, I'm taking Eli Laughing

Any other situation is Brady


Clever Laughing

I would pick Brady though. Both are able to perform under pressure and both certainly are HOFers at the end of the respective careers, but the only reason why we have this debate since 2007 is because Eli has had the better defense for dealing with offenses of the 21st century.
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dahobofest


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 10:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

reckless123 wrote:
FirstDownFaulk wrote:
iPwn wrote:
E-Man wrote:
iPwn wrote:
How is a guy that plays in several systems throughout his career the definition of a system QB? They have changed the system so often to better accommodate the revolving door of talent around Brady, and he continues to thrive despite that. A system QB is one that can only be successful in one type of system (like Jeff Garcia in the WCO). Brady is the furthest thing from that, as proven by your admission that the offense continues to evolve.


key word: accommodate.

that describes it perfectly...

the Pats have to accommodate him.

he's still a system QB...just the master of many...which is why he is a good QB.


I said accommodate the talent aroun him, not accomodate him. It would be beyond stupid if the Patriots were trying to run the exact same offense with Gronk and Hernandez that they did with Moss. It would have been stupid if they didn't adjust the offense that was was designed for Reche Caldwell and Doug Gabriel in 06 to better take advantage of Randy Moss and Wes Welker in 07.

How are you even trying to make this a knock on him? You put any players in any offense that those players are used to, and Brady is going to be effective. That is exactly what you want in a QB, to be able to adapt his game to the players aroun him and still be great. This means that the Patriots can sign or draft any player they want and not worry about how his talent fits into what they try to do, because they can adjust the system (or completely change it) to use those players without fear that their QB won't be able to master it. I cannot for the life of me understand why you would call him a mirage and suggest that these changes have been made to make things easier for him.

This is what most of the "Brady Haters" are either incapable of realizing or simply refusing to realize. They cling to the "system quarterback" argument without realizing that he's played in FIVE different systems in his 10+ seasons. The proof is there for everyone to see, even those who refuse to, and it's that he is the system. Of course they "accommodate" their quarterback, it would be foolish not to. People continue to say this like it's a bad thing, but if you want to succeed as an organization you'll have a system in place that accentuates your signal callers strengths.

It amazes me that people still try to spin this as a bad thing and use it to discredit the guy in comparisons. If you prefer Eli and his propensity to throw an interception once every 30 attempts (Brady is every 48 attempts), then you can have him. I'll play the percentages and go with the guy who puts it in the end zone more often (Brady once every 17 attempts, Eli once every 21 attempts) over the guy who puts it into the hands of his opponents much more often.

If anyone is a "system quarterback" in this debate...it's Eli. He's had the luxury of playing under the same coordinator, Kevin Gilbride, since 2006.


Are you really calling Eli a system QB? Eli would flourish in any system. Have we really got to the point where if you stay in one system then your a system QB.


It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dahobofest wrote:

It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.


The question was never whether Eli is a better QB then Brady. And many times throughout this thread we've stated Eli is NOT a better QB then Brady. The OP question was:

mozwanted wrote:
Who is a bigger game QB?
Tom Brady or Eli Manning?
[/i]

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dahobofest


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shockey1979 wrote:
dahobofest wrote:

It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.


The question was never whether Eli is a better QB then Brady. And many times throughout this thread we've stated Eli is NOT a better QB then Brady. The OP question was:

mozwanted wrote:
Who is a bigger game QB?
Tom Brady or Eli Manning?
[/i]


It's the SAME question. Players play the same in big games and little games. A better player plays better over a large enough sample of games in "big games" than a worse player. All Giants fans can ever harp on is "clutchness," which is a made up phenomena.
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reckless123


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dahobofest wrote:


It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.


Normally i'd ignore you in this case i should but i just cant help myself. The question was "Who is a bigger big game QB?". Not who is a better QB.

it took him 5 years according to you but hes arguably a top 5 QB, so how is that for progress.
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dahobofest


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

reckless123 wrote:
dahobofest wrote:


It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.


Normally i'd ignore you in this case i should but i just cant help myself. The question was "Who is a bigger big game QB?". Not who is a better QB.

it took him 5 years according to you but hes arguably a top 5 QB, so how is that for progress.


read above.
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x0x


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone who thinks Eli Manning cannot surpass Tom Brady on all-time rankings is fooling themselves.


Eli Manning is the only QB to lead two Championship teams through 4 playoff game schedules. He's got 5 playoff road wins.


A 3rd trophy and a league MVP and he may equal Brady.




I'm mostly joking, he's got a lot of work to do but he has a shot certainly.
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Shockey1979


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dahobofest wrote:
Shockey1979 wrote:
dahobofest wrote:

It took him like 5 years with the same team/coach to be a somewhat productive quarterback...


Regardless, how is this thread even a debate. You'd have to be an idiot to think Eli Manning is better than Tom Brady.


The question was never whether Eli is a better QB then Brady. And many times throughout this thread we've stated Eli is NOT a better QB then Brady. The OP question was:

mozwanted wrote:
Who is a bigger game QB?
Tom Brady or Eli Manning?
[/i]


It's the SAME question. Players play the same in big games and little games. A better player plays better over a large enough sample of games in "big games" than a worse player. All Giants fans can ever harp on is "clutchness," which is a made up phenomena.


Your opinion.

But a player can be more talented as Brady is more talented then Eli and perform worse in big games under pressure. And players can be less talented and perform better under pressure.

The only reason why you downplay clutch/choke is because your a Romo homer which all Romo homers do.
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