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DT58_lives_on


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
Posts: 5791
Location: St. Cloud, MN
PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Baldwin has from all reports been sensational in preseason, putting in all the work, making big catches, etc...He's now in his 2nd year and is a first round afterthought if you're a D preparing to play the Chiefs.


They guy isn't on the field for the vast majority of the offensive plays. He's starting to get out there more...but I agree...again with Rage.

Quote:
Calm down folks. I know it is a freakin tough time to be a Chief fan but I am freakin sick and tired of all this talk about how we are some embarrassing organization and some frowned upon team.


It'd be different if this was a bad year because of injuries, or one bad year in a string of good ones. But it's not, we had one ok year against the weakest schedule in football. Now when we have a team "full of talent" it seems hard to imagine winning 5 games? And it's not just the fans over-reacting here Mike...we are absolutely a laughing stock, and unlike the Saint, nobody feels bad for us. They're just disappointed, and ready to say "I TOLD YOU SO" all over Cassel's failures.
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HiccupGuy


Joined: 01 Jun 2011
Posts: 1992
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jakuvious wrote:
HiccupGuy wrote:

Would going out and saying we are going after Manning or wanting RG3 admiring Cassel is not the guy?

We don't need all pro players to win. We need players that are not selfish and help the team. We have enough ProBowl/All Pro players on the team. We just need soils players that can step it up every now and then.

These FA players everyone wanted us try and get. Well they are not a long term answer. So why go and get them to compete against some thing we already have at starting. A glorified back. They might not play as bad as Cassel but they would still suck. And we would still be hearing the same thing we are hearing now. Pioli knows nothing about QBs and oh noes we suck again.


PROBABLY suck. It's the same as why so many want Quinn or Stanzi to get a chance. Multiple guys who probably suck still provide a better chance of finding one that doesn't suck than just trying one guy who probably sucks. Cassel failed, so what's the worst that would happen if we gave another guy a shot? He fails worse? It's not like we can not miss the playoffs harder.


Yeah, but what's the point of having a different QB start every weekend. We want to see constancy with our team but that doesn't include the QB position untill we find a good one? Sorry but are we trying to kill this team? What kind of a message does that send to the other guys in the locker room?

Again what's the point of picking up another QB that's is not for the FUTURE? There is no reason. Just another stepping stone that does not address the main need. Or does it dress the need of the fan needing to know that Cassel is not the guy? We all know he is not.
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HiccupGuy


Joined: 01 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
Hiccup, you forgot about Orton/Campbell...one of who was already proven here and players believed in. Both came fairly cheap. Weeden, i'm glad we didn't pick, but he would be an upgrade. Wilson we should've picked. You really think Wilson would struggle as much as he has with Charles, Bowe, and Co. ? Regardless, Wilson is still already playing better than Cassel and he's only gonna get better. Even if the team didn't play as well as we think they would with Orton, that wouldn't be on Pioli, atleast he made a change. However, I think it's pretty far fetched to believe we wouldn't do pretty well with Orton.

Another thing I find truly disturbing"
2011-Bowe/Carr's last year of contract-we select Baldwin instead of Dalton and then get J.Brown. Carr is gone, There seems to be no attempt to keep Bowe and he is franchised.
2012-Albert's last year-we pick Stephenson instead of Wilson...

It's fine to draft guys to replace certain guys who might leave or aren't worth resigning...it's a whole other story when you seem more intent on drafting replacements for good established players, INSTEAD of finding a STARTER for your weak spots, maybe even a QB and looking to resign those good young players.

The Baldwin picks just looks every bit as foolish as T-Jack right now, not just because of Dalton's success. Baldwin has from all reports been sensational in preseason, putting in all the work, making big catches, etc...He's now in his 2nd year and is a first round afterthought if you're a D preparing to play the Chiefs.

If Pioli's plan was to let Bowe walk next year...well he's clearly letting the team's best WR go. If his plan was to keep both...well Scott, it's usually a good idea to get a QB who can utilize two standout receivers, BEFORE you get the 2nd WR.


Orton didn't want to be a starter or play to be a starter and that was pretty clear by what team he picked. Same goes for Campbell. Neither of those are QBOTF either and are just average. So getting them would just hold this team back like it has for many years. Get Vets that are average at best instead of drafting a QBOTF.

No one thought Dalton would of been good at the next level hindsight is always better when you know. Baldwin was drafted instead of Dalton b/c we all saw WR as the weakest link. Cassel played average that year as well.

Weeden is 29 year old rookie in the first. It would of been stupid to pick him with our first or trade up to get him. Sure he would of been a upgrade but he has what 6 years of prime in him if he hits it after his rookie year. Then we would be in this mess again of needing a QB.

I wanted Wilson in the 3rd but that fact is we don't know what he is going to end up being and we had Stanzi who you and I thought was going to be good. Why draft what looked like a developmental QB again? Wilson has not been impressive at all since the season has started. The fact you bring up our players to try to make him successful means you don't know the Seahawks. They are as loaded as we are but with a better O-line.

Baldwin pick doesn't look foolish. Look back at 2010 and tell me what was the weak link. It was WR. We had Bowe and no one else.
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Jakuvious


Joined: 06 Sep 2010
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HiccupGuy wrote:

Yeah, but what's the point of having a different QB start every weekend. We want to see constancy with our team but that doesn't include the QB position untill we find a good one? Sorry but are we trying to kill this team? What kind of a message does that send to the other guys in the locker room?

Again what's the point of picking up another QB that's is not for the FUTURE? There is no reason. Just another stepping stone that does not address the main need. Or does it dress the need of the fan needing to know that Cassel is not the guy? We all know he is not.


That you're actively trying to win?
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HiccupGuy


Joined: 01 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Jakuvious wrote:
HiccupGuy wrote:

Yeah, but what's the point of having a different QB start every weekend. We want to see constancy with our team but that doesn't include the QB position untill we find a good one? Sorry but are we trying to kill this team? What kind of a message does that send to the other guys in the locker room?

Again what's the point of picking up another QB that's is not for the FUTURE? There is no reason. Just another stepping stone that does not address the main need. Or does it dress the need of the fan needing to know that Cassel is not the guy? We all know he is not.


That you're actively trying to win?


What team has been able to do that and win vr teams that do that and the whole team quits?

I pretty sure the list is a lot longer on the quitting.
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ArrowheadRage58


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HiccupGuy wrote:


Orton didn't want to be a starter or play to be a starter and that was pretty clear by what team he picked. Same goes for Campbell. Neither of those are QBOTF either and are just average. So getting them would just hold this team back like it has for many years. Get Vets that are average at best instead of drafting a QBOTF.

No one thought Dalton would of been good at the next level hindsight is always better when you know. Baldwin was drafted instead of Dalton b/c we all saw WR as the weakest link. Cassel played average that year as well.

Weeden is 29 year old rookie in the first. It would of been stupid to pick him with our first or trade up to get him. Sure he would of been a upgrade but he has what 6 years of prime in him if he hits it after his rookie year. Then we would be in this mess again of needing a QB.

I wanted Wilson in the 3rd but that fact is we don't know what he is going to end up being and we had Stanzi who you and I thought was going to be good. Why draft what looked like a developmental QB again? Wilson has not been impressive at all since the season has started. The fact you bring up our players to try to make him successful means you don't know the Seahawks. They are as loaded as we are but with a better O-line.

Baldwin pick doesn't look foolish. Look back at 2010 and tell me what was the weak link. It was WR. We had Bowe and no one else.


So you're basically saying it's better to risk sucking with Cassel and get a better pick than to be a playoff team with Orton? Regardless of what we want, Pioli needs to win to keep his job, so basically he's a complete and total moron.

The Bengals thought Dalton would be good...you don't use a high 2nd round pick if you don't. Who saw WR as the weakest link? Not me, not most fans...Cassel was brutal in '10, especially at the end. We already had DMX and had brought in Breaston. Ultimately I like the idea of having Baldwin over Dalton, but that's only if we can find something better at QB. Stop bringing up Weeden..we agree on him.

About Wilson, I liked him and I would certainly of taken him over a LT...and you'd think Pioli, with the knowledge that he didn't have anyone he thot could compete with Cassel should've been looking for someone. Seahawks are loaded? LOL They have a good RB who is at the top of the league because he doesn't split carries, but he's really only like top 15. We have one of, if not the best. They have a deep WR core, but not true #1. We have a deep WR core and a true #1.

Again, the Baldwin pick looks foolish because he's become a beast of sorts but the opposing defenses dont' even have to game plan for him because our QB is so bad.
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People just seem to be mad because the chiefs are all of a sudden doing what their fans thought they were capable of
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DT58_lives_on


Joined: 04 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It was WR.


Gabe Carimi and the RT position say hello.
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HiccupGuy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 8:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DT58_lives_on wrote:
Quote:
It was WR.


Gabe Carimi and the RT position say hello.


Yeah, I forgot about the RT position. But WR was our second weak link really close behind RT.
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HiccupGuy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ArrowheadRage58 wrote:
So you're basically saying it's better to risk sucking with Cassel and get a better pick than to be a playoff team with Orton? Regardless of what we want, Pioli needs to win to keep his job, so basically he's a complete and total moron.

The Bengals thought Dalton would be good...you don't use a high 2nd round pick if you don't. Who saw WR as the weakest link? Not me, not most fans...Cassel was brutal in '10, especially at the end. We already had DMX and had brought in Breaston. Ultimately I like the idea of having Baldwin over Dalton, but that's only if we can find something better at QB. Stop bringing up Weeden..we agree on him.

About Wilson, I liked him and I would certainly of taken him over a LT...and you'd think Pioli, with the knowledge that he didn't have anyone he thot could compete with Cassel should've been looking for someone. Seahawks are loaded? LOL They have a good RB who is at the top of the league because he doesn't split carries, but he's really only like top 15. We have one of, if not the best. They have a deep WR core, but not true #1. We have a deep WR core and a true #1.

Again, the Baldwin pick looks foolish because he's become a beast of sorts but the opposing defenses dont' even have to game plan for him because our QB is so bad.


Yup, I guess I am saying let's suck with Cassel instead of getting Orton. Because I didn't at all say Orton didn't want a starting job. Rolling Eyes

You didn't see WR as one of the weakest links in 2010? Okay. 2010 WRs were Bowe, Chambers, Copper, Tucker and Horne. DMX was unknown/injury prone in 2010 and after that season we moved him to RB. Breaston was brought in several months after Baldwin was pick b/c of the lock out.

I agree I would have lived Wilson over a back up LT. Lynch is still a good runningback and take the pressure off of Wilson no more then Charles would. Rice is a true #1 WR, Tate is a good deep threat, and Baldwin is a great slot. Their O-line is still better then ours, well at least against the pass.


Why would teams game plan for the number 2 WR? He isn't even the best WR on the team.
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simonwayne


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was thinking about this today. Since this is a team needs thread, we NEED to lock up Albert so that we can tag Bowe this offseason if he won't resign. We have 26 million in cap space, after all.
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HiccupGuy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 9:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

simonwayne wrote:
Was thinking about this today. Since this is a team needs thread, we NEED to lock up Albert so that we can tag Bowe this offseason if he won't resign. We have 26 million in cap space, after all.


We need to lock up both and draft Smith or Wilson.
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HiccupGuy wrote:
simonwayne wrote:
Was thinking about this today. Since this is a team needs thread, we NEED to lock up Albert so that we can tag Bowe this offseason if he won't resign. We have 26 million in cap space, after all.


We need to lock up both and draft Smith or Wilson.


+10000000
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nicfre2011


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a dream the other night that we stumbled and bumbled through the rest of the season and this offseason the only big change made was that Eric Mangini was hired by Pioli to take over DC responsibilities from Crennel so Romeo could "focus on being a head coach in 2014". I can see the Pioli press conference now.
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