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Three Weeks In - The Biggest Problem Is ___________
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 5649
Location: Gainesville, FL
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?
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DOLFAN016


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 646
Location: Central Pennsylvania
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 5649
Location: Gainesville, FL
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


At this point, it's apples and oranges. Marshall played with a different QB, HC, OC. We really have no idea how he would've fared in the current system.

Hartline is a #2 receiver. He is good at some things (body control, hands, catching contested balls), but in his 4 seasons he's done nothing much to scare anybody. This team needs a #1, and we should get him through the draft.
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phinmun


Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 2231
Location: South Carolina
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


This offense is about timing and being able to get to a spot. Marshall out-fought many CBs for the ball but he didn't fit in this style of offense. Plus, how easy do you think the coaches thought it would be to try and get this diva veteran to become a completely different, more precise type of player?

Marshall isn't a bad player, he's very, very good in some situations but Tannehill wouldn't have been able to rely upon Marshall being exactly where he needed to be the way he can with Bess or Hartline.

The biggest evidence of this was the lack of TDs produced by Marshall when the team was close to the goal-line. How many times did we run a quick slant and nearly see something disastrous because Marshall got pushed out of the way by the CB? I remember that happening a lot. Neither Henne nor Moore could really rely upon Marshall down deep in the red zone.

Plus, Marshall doesn't have the elite type of speed you want your biggest threat to have. He was tough and fought for extra yards but wasn't going to out-run anyone.

He just wasn't the ideal fit in this offense as you can see. Add all his other problems and it made sense to move on as a team.
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DOLFAN016


Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 646
Location: Central Pennsylvania
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

phinmun wrote:
DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


This offense is about timing and being able to get to a spot. Marshall out-fought many CBs for the ball but he didn't fit in this style of offense.

Marshall isn't a bad player, he's very, very good in some situations but Tannehill wouldn't have been able to rely upon Marshall being exactly where he needed to be the way he can with Bess or Hartline.

The biggest evidence of this was the lack of TDs produced by Marshall when the team was close to the goal-line. How many times did we run a quick slant and nearly see something disastrous because Marshall got pushed out of the way by the CB? I remember that happening a lot. Neither Henne nor Moore could really rely upon Marshall down deep in the red zone.

Plus, Marshall doesn't have the elite type of speed you want your biggest threat to have. He was tough and fought for extra yards but wasn't going to out-run anyone.

He just wasn't the ideal fit in this offense as you can see. Add all his other problems and it made sense to move on as a team.


Completely agree with both of your posts. I think the main reason to get rid Marshall other than the system obviously was so Tanny didn't have that "safety valve". In other words, he would've really stunted Tanny's growth because he maybe wouldn't have gone through the reads and relied on Brandon too much. I really can't wait to see which WRs we add next year. In the meantime we need to give Matthews a lot more reps.
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PhinFan52


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4328
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


At this point, it's apples and oranges. Marshall played with a different QB, HC, OC. We really have no idea how he would've fared in the current system.

Hartline is a #2 receiver. He is good at some things (body control, hands, catching contested balls), but in his 4 seasons he's done nothing much to scare anybody. This team needs a #1, and we should get him through the draft.


Not true.. same QB ..HC.. OC in 2010 and 2011...
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PhinFan52


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4328
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the guy is avg'ing 18 yrds a catch... so it's be better if he was avg'ing 13 ypc and 5 YAC ???? and without a stud #1 receiver on the other side... leading the NFL in yards... (so far) again without a stud on the other side..

Last edited by PhinFan52 on Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PhinFan52


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4328
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


depends on who's thrown to in the redzone.. but I'll take a guy avg'ing 15-18 YPC anyday... gets me in the redzone
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cddolphin


Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 5649
Location: Gainesville, FL
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PhinFan52 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


At this point, it's apples and oranges. Marshall played with a different QB, HC, OC. We really have no idea how he would've fared in the current system.

Hartline is a #2 receiver. He is good at some things (body control, hands, catching contested balls), but in his 4 seasons he's done nothing much to scare anybody. This team needs a #1, and we should get him through the draft.


Not true.. same QB ..HC.. OC in 2010 and 2011...


What I mean is, Marshall played with a different QB/HC/OC last year then he would have this year. So we don't know how he'd be performing this year with Tannehill and Co.
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PhinFan52


Joined: 01 Nov 2007
Posts: 4328
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
DOLFAN016 wrote:
cddolphin wrote:
PhinFan52 wrote:
isn't it funny how a guy can lead a team in AVG PER CATCH.. yet not be a great YAC guy ???

ya know Marshall yac was like 2.9 and 4.8 in last 2 seasons with Phins... Hartlines yac last 2 season was 5.2 and 2.9 ( I belive ) Interesting...


Stats can be misleading. ^^Those stats could easily be the result of opposing defenses rolling more coverage to Marshall's side.

Bottom line is, put the ball into Marshall's hands or Hartline's hands, and who is more of a threat to score?


Are we handing it off to Marshall? We know he can't catch balls in the end zone. Sorry I had to. I've always thought of Hartline as being undervalued...not underrated. He is a extremely hard worker that is not a diva. Having a #1 was good and all, but where did it get us?


At this point, it's apples and oranges. Marshall played with a different QB, HC, OC. We really have no idea how he would've fared in the current system.

Hartline is a #2 receiver. He is good at some things (body control, hands, catching contested balls), but in his 4 seasons he's done nothing much to scare anybody. This team needs a #1, and we should get him through the draft.


Not true.. same QB ..HC.. OC in 2010 and 2011...


What I mean is, Marshall played with a different QB/HC/OC last year then he would have this year. So we don't know how he'd be performing this year with Tannehill and Co.


I went heads up on the 2 season on same team... and really I would've thught Cutler would've been a better QB then Tanny, atleast this season..
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bpastermack


Joined: 17 Feb 2009
Posts: 12927
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We don't need a number 1 receiver. But I wouldn't mind a guy with flat out speed and quickness and another who can go up for some jump balls and be a red zone target. I think that would complete this receiver group. So just a Mike Wallace and an AJ Green. That's all I'm asking for. Seriously though, I wish we could go back in time and take Chris Givens instead of that TE in the 3rd round. I was on my knees begging for Miami to take him too.

But the good thing is if Tannehill can have almost 450 yards against a great D with this group of receivers, then imagine what he could do with some great ones!!
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