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When will we open up the passing game?
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steadypimpin


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mrscottso wrote:
Miami49er wrote:
c0insnap wrote:
Honestly, we probably won't. It's just not Harbaugh's style. That's why I was confused by the signings of Moss, Manningham and the additions of Jenkins and James. We clearly aren't going to spread the field around and Moss only plays a 5th of the snaps.
i doubt that it isn't Harbaugh's style. I've seen Andrew Luck chuck it deep plenty of times while at Stanford under Harbaugh. Sure we'll never be the greatest show on turf, but to be an effective power run oriented offense you need to be able to throw it deep. Maybe it is a little bit of both. Maybe it's Harbaugh tailoring the offense around what he thinks Alex can or can't do. I mean think about when Kap has been under center in the preseason. The play calling was completely different. Regardless of what Harbaugh thinks Alex can or can't do, he has to allow Alex to throw down the field. And at the same time, I've read that Alex has a lot of flexibility in the offense, so he should be taking some chances deep.



I'm not sure what the problem is. Alex needs to take about 4 shots down field a game. With our running attack, we should be feasting on defenses with play actions.
Plus in today's NFL half the time you throw one deep you end up getting a defensive PI call so it will work. Laughing
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Chrissooner49er


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll wait and see. We went down field more often last year, we just need to see how it evolves.

And those who are lamenting Moss growing on the sideline (hah! See what I did there?! Razz ), remember that he spent an entire year out of football and is 35. Bring him along slowly or he will be lost entirely due to little injuries that add up...just my .02.
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Ataal


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've always felt the signings of Jenkins, Moss, and Manningham was not because we would throw it more often, but that when we do throw it, we have players that can make those plays with a higher percentage than what we've had. Heck, the names alone make a difference on the field(and off the field).

That being said, our offense was so vanilla during the Vikings game, it wasn't even funny. You've got to take a shot downfield once in a while. Otherwise, the defense will do exactly what the Vikings defense did, populate the field 5-15 yards from the line of scrimmage. This not only hurts our short yardage passing game, it hurts our running game as well. Which it did. We could have taken advantage of this with a 20+ yard throw into one man coverage. Maybe we tried, but I don't remember it. We abandoned the run early, which hurt us in passing as well. Then, with what? 6 minutes or so left to play and down two scores, we went back to the run? Ugh.

To some degree, I'm glad Alex got that interception. Talk about relieving some pressure to keep it safe. Let's see how we adjust in the Jets game before we get too crazy with the deep ball talk.
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sbrown


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its a tough call fellas. I always see someone open underneathe so can you blame alex for not going to the short route and not risk waiting in the pocket for something to open? Like I said some of the more prolific QB's will take those shots, but they have been taking those shots down field for years, and alex was brought up in this offense to manage turnovers and get ball out quickly, lets win field position and let defense take it home. So I cant blame alex for not taking those chances. He needs to take a chance once in a while but we do have open wrs underneathe all game long.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sbrown wrote:
Its a tough call fellas. I always see someone open underneathe so can you blame alex for not going to the short route and not risk waiting in the pocket for something to open? Like I said some of the more prolific QB's will take those shots, but they have been taking those shots down field for years, and alex was brought up in this offense to manage turnovers and get ball out quickly, lets win field position and let defense take it home. So I cant blame alex for not taking those chances. He needs to take a chance once in a while but we do have open wrs underneathe all game long.


Agree with all of this. It's not as exciting as the deep passes... I want more of the deep passes... but if his first read is open? He's generally gonna hit it quickly and not even look for read #2. High % passes.. it is either what he prefers or it's what Jim and Greg prefer and coach him to take. Because they don't like Alex's deep ball? Because they don't trust our pass pro? Because they like to keep it safe knowing we generally have a strong defense and STs? That is anyone's guess.
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SoCalNiner


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 1:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
sbrown wrote:
Its a tough call fellas. I always see someone open underneathe so can you blame alex for not going to the short route and not risk waiting in the pocket for something to open? Like I said some of the more prolific QB's will take those shots, but they have been taking those shots down field for years, and alex was brought up in this offense to manage turnovers and get ball out quickly, lets win field position and let defense take it home. So I cant blame alex for not taking those chances. He needs to take a chance once in a while but we do have open wrs underneathe all game long.


Agree with all of this. It's not as exciting as the deep passes... I want more of the deep passes... but if his first read is open? He's generally gonna hit it quickly and not even look for read #2. High % passes.. it is either what he prefers or it's what Jim and Greg prefer and coach him to take. Because they don't like Alex's deep ball? Because they don't trust our pass pro? Because they like to keep it safe knowing we generally have a strong defense and STs? That is anyone's guess.


I've come to accept that Alex will usually take his 1st read, and that ok. While it's generally not the deeper route, it's a higher % pass like you say. I'll admit I do get frustrated at times, but it's no big deal. One example was when I was at the Lion's game, I saw Moss get one on one with a good shot at a large gain, but Alex took the underneath route. I wasn't too happy, but that drive resulted in a TD, so I was good with it. The problem with this week is that the Vikes found out that we love to get yardage little by little and our short routes were absolutely shut down.

When it comes to Alex I know one thing is for sure, and it's that he absolutely needs to get in a groove. Once he does so, we drive the ball like no other. We need to run to open the pass, that's one of the best ways to get Alex comfy. I'm not saying that he makes bad decisions when he gets flustered, but he seems to take a little longer to make up his mind.

I think Alex will bounce back this week, as will our entire team. I find it hard to believe that this team we saw last week will be the same team well see throughout the year.
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oldman9er


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agree with all of this, SoCal. This Sunday can really say a lot about how our entire season goes. Gotta say, I am a lil worried. Guess we knew we would be in for a scrap.. but I was expecting ( or maybe better to say hoping for ) a much more dynamic passing game than what I am frequently seeing from us.
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SoCalNiner


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

oldman9er wrote:
Agree with all of this, SoCal. This Sunday can really say a lot about how our entire season goes. Gotta say, I am a lil worried. Guess we knew we would be in for a scrap.. but I was expecting ( or maybe better to say hoping for ) a much more dynamic passing game than what I am frequently seeing from us.


I'd be lying if I said I wasn't worried too. Our inability to get to the QB and Staley's regression top my list. I'm hoping for a more dynamic passing game as well.
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sbrown


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I too wish our passing game was more dynamic. I mentioned it in another thread I wish any 49ers QB led the league in passing. But I will accept a SB any way I can get it. I cant complain when ALex takes a short pass. I just hope that when it is time for him to win a game on his shoulders he does. until then im cool with the even run pass ratio and efficiency
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FG21_PW52


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 2:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

neezy007 wrote:
Maybe Alex isn't confident in guys not named Vernon Davis. He is the only guy who he will take a chance with, and strangely enough, he has the worst hands and catching technique out of all our guys. Our WR core, in general, is as sure handed as any in the league.


Vernon might have the worst hands, but I saw 2 or 3 balls Randy should have caught on Sunday. I don't blame Alex when that kinda crap is happening. Half-azzzzzzzing it doesn't work. I would say it works even less in important games but I see every game as important.
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NINERFAN_4_LIFE


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 6:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been saying it for years now, we need to go deep more (Twss). If we can score quick like we did against the lions (4 plays) it would really make teams fear us. Sometimes you gotta just take a quick five step drop-PUMP FAKE!!!! Then chuck it up and hope your guy beats his man. I don't understand why we don't do either of these things more often. PUMP FAKE ... PLEASE!!!!!!! Once alex realizes its his job to manipulate defenses instead of letting them dictate what he does, he will be dangerous.
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steadypimpin


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 10:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NINERFAN_4_LIFE wrote:
I've been saying it for years now, we need to go deep more (Twss). If we can score quick like we did against the lions (4 plays) it would really make teams fear us. Sometimes you gotta just take a quick five step drop-PUMP FAKE!!!! Then chuck it up and hope your guy beats his man. I don't understand why we don't do either of these things more often. PUMP FAKE ... PLEASE!!!!!!! Once alex realizes its his job to manipulate defenses instead of letting them dictate what he does, he will be dangerous.
Even if our guy doesn't get it, we probably have a good shot at a PI call in our favor. I agree though, we need to take some shots downfield simply for the fact that the defense can respect our offense. They know our game and they're ready for it now, we need to expose that. Maybe it's part of Jim's plan.
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NextBigThing


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh9518jqK1A

It's pretty obvious Moss still has moves here. Thats a nice juke, which should have resulted in a touchdown.
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steadypimpin


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NextBigThing wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh9518jqK1A

It's pretty obvious Moss still has moves here. Thats a nice juke, which should have resulted in a touchdown.
I hope that's not the play where some said Randy could've got that because I remember that one too.
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sbrown


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2012 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

steadypimpin wrote:
NextBigThing wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh9518jqK1A

It's pretty obvious Moss still has moves here. Thats a nice juke, which should have resulted in a touchdown.
I hope that's not the play where some said Randy could've got that because I remember that one too.


That is the play some say moss was lazy or whatever. it was a bad throw. but it was not this great move by moss either. Laughing
On that play Alex needs to stay in the pocket and deliver the strike.
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