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T1TANS f4n LIFE
Joined: 22 Oct 2008
Posts: 1536
Location: Manchester, TN
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 Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:29 am Post subject: Chris Johnson and the line: Tale of the Tape (Week 1) |
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I know this topic has been torn to pieces and talked about constantly. How is this thread ANY different? I'm here to give you the run down on our man Chris Johnson's carries against the New England Patriots. What was the cause of our stagnant running game? Play calling? CJ? Line? We're about to find out. Let's begin!
(Sorry for the low quality pictures. I tried my best and it took forever.. )
So, what is your take? Has CJ lost his ability or the ability to trust his offensive line?
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 9:13 am Post subject: |
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| He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
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UTMoc10
Joined: 18 Oct 2009
Posts: 1660
Location: Chattanooga, TN
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:32 am Post subject: |
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Awesome post. Thanks for the breakdown.
I agree with s-camp I think most of CJ's issues are mental. He keeps trying to hit the homerun play instead of getting 3-4 yards. Those plays leave us in 3rd and long and we are off the field. He can't get into a rhythm because he isn't helping move the chains.
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carpbeatch
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 97
Location: Titanville
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:40 am Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 10:52 am Post subject: |
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| carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
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carpbeatch
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 97
Location: Titanville
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
I thought we were talking about Sunday, if you want to talk about his career then we have a much larger sample size of how dangerous he is when the o-line blocks effectively. |
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TitanSS
Joined: 07 Jan 2007
Posts: 2034
Location: My house
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
From this breakdown there was only one play where Johnson had a hole to run through and Cook missed the block on Mayo and CJ was noted to have been slowed down by Hutch getting destroyed on his block. The other was a 5 yard gain.
In the rest of the snapshots there is absolutely no where to go. All CJ could do is put his head down and hope to fall forward, which would have been hard to do considering most of the time that would have been a loss of yards. I thought it was CJs fault for jumping laterally so often but after seeing snap shots of how poorly it was blocked at the point of attack I'm not so sure we can blame as much on him as I had originally thought.
He still needs to just put his head down and run, but even if he had done that I'm convinced he may have had an extra 5 yards all day. Tops. |
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TwoToneBlue
Joined: 22 May 2008
Posts: 5748
Location: Ohio
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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Awesome post tfl! Great to actually see the pics of the runs.
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:12 pm Post subject: |
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| carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
I thought we were talking about Sunday, if you want to talk about his career then we have a much larger sample size of how dangerous he is when the o-line blocks effectively. |
Hilarious. Yeah he's a real dangerous weapon these days 
What he did his first couple of years is irrelevant at this point. Last season and so far this season he's running timid/scared/uninterested/whatever you want to call it. There are in fact holes, whether they show up in the still pics in this analysis or not. They don't last long and they're not huge, but ffs this is the NFL. The defenses are pretty good. CJ can't wait for perfect blocking.
Last edited by s_camp on Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:15 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| TitanSS wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
From this breakdown there was only one play where Johnson had a hole to run through and Cook missed the block on Mayo and CJ was noted to have been slowed down by Hutch getting destroyed on his block. The other was a 5 yard gain.
In the rest of the snapshots there is absolutely no where to go. All CJ could do is put his head down and hope to fall forward, which would have been hard to do considering most of the time that would have been a loss of yards. I thought it was CJs fault for jumping laterally so often but after seeing snap shots of how poorly it was blocked at the point of attack I'm not so sure we can blame as much on him as I had originally thought.
He still needs to just put his head down and run, but even if he had done that I'm convinced he may have had an extra 5 yards all day. Tops. |
Snapshots, which cannot present the full picture. There were holes in that game. They weren't huge, and they didn't last long, but most NFL backs would have hit them, and hit them hard, and taken what little was available. CJ of 2008 or 2009 would have done it, but 2011 and 2012 CJ obviously will not. |
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carpbeatch
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 97
Location: Titanville
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:29 pm Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | TitanSS wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | He may have lost some physical ability by now, but not enough to cause what we've been seeing for over a year now. His issues are mental, IMO. He just won't move forward. Even if he does get a little space, when the defenders close in he turns his back or heads for the sideline. His first couple/few years he would lower his head and get another yard or two (or at least try). |
These stills don't really validate your point at all. We saw such a small sample size against New England, but of the few opportunities he had the majority of his runs were poorly blocked. |
We've got an enormous sample size. He's been doing this crap for over a year now. The blocking is not very good, but there are holes there that he just won't take. |
From this breakdown there was only one play where Johnson had a hole to run through and Cook missed the block on Mayo and CJ was noted to have been slowed down by Hutch getting destroyed on his block. The other was a 5 yard gain.
In the rest of the snapshots there is absolutely no where to go. All CJ could do is put his head down and hope to fall forward, which would have been hard to do considering most of the time that would have been a loss of yards. I thought it was CJs fault for jumping laterally so often but after seeing snap shots of how poorly it was blocked at the point of attack I'm not so sure we can blame as much on him as I had originally thought.
He still needs to just put his head down and run, but even if he had done that I'm convinced he may have had an extra 5 yards all day. Tops. |
Snapshots, which cannot present the full picture. There were holes in that game. They weren't huge, and they didn't last long, but most NFL backs would have hit them, and hit them hard, and taken what little was available. CJ of 2008 or 2009 would have done it, but 2011 and 2012 CJ obviously will not. |
No dude, you are hilarious. You get actual picture evidence and you still want to argue your point. Nobody said he needs to have perfect blocking, hell I'd settle for decent blocking. Dude if there's constant penetration it screws with the timing of the play, which in return makes the back try to avoid the first guy. After that, the holes are gone man. But you've already developed in your mind what the problem is... so much so that even when some posts pictures and explanations of what happened each play, you refuse to believe it. Funny stuff |
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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| carpbeatch wrote: | | No dude, you are hilarious. You get actual picture evidence and you still want to argue your point. Nobody said he needs to have perfect blocking, hell I'd settle for decent blocking. Dude if there's constant penetration it screws with the timing of the play, which in return makes the back try to avoid the first guy. After that, the holes are gone man. But you've already developed in your mind what the problem is... so much so that even when some posts pictures and explanations of what happened each play, you refuse to believe it. Funny stuff |
You think a freeze frame from each play is conclusive proof? Get outta here. The game tape is available, go watch it. I didn't realize TfL's analysis was being accepted as absolutely authoritative.
I agree that CJ too often has to avoid defenders in the backfield. Yes the blocking is generally poor. But why does he still suck when the OL actually does block reasonably well? Because, as I have said, he refuses to just run forward. |
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carpbeatch
Joined: 25 Nov 2007
Posts: 97
Location: Titanville
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | No dude, you are hilarious. You get actual picture evidence and you still want to argue your point. Nobody said he needs to have perfect blocking, hell I'd settle for decent blocking. Dude if there's constant penetration it screws with the timing of the play, which in return makes the back try to avoid the first guy. After that, the holes are gone man. But you've already developed in your mind what the problem is... so much so that even when some posts pictures and explanations of what happened each play, you refuse to believe it. Funny stuff |
You think a freeze frame from each play is conclusive proof? Get outta here. The game tape is available, go watch it. I didn't realize TfL's analysis was being accepted as absolutely authoritative.
I agree that CJ too often has to avoid defenders in the backfield. Yes the blocking is generally poor. But why does he still suck when the OL actually does block reasonably well? Because, as I have said, he refuses to just run forward. |
Tfl's analysis isn't proof of anything, I just thought your reaction to it was silly. His analysis and my own two eyes less me to my opinion. |
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Obie09
Joined: 04 Oct 2009
Posts: 318
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:00 pm Post subject: |
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| s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | No dude, you are hilarious. You get actual picture evidence and you still want to argue your point. Nobody said he needs to have perfect blocking, hell I'd settle for decent blocking. Dude if there's constant penetration it screws with the timing of the play, which in return makes the back try to avoid the first guy. After that, the holes are gone man. But you've already developed in your mind what the problem is... so much so that even when some posts pictures and explanations of what happened each play, you refuse to believe it. Funny stuff |
You think a freeze frame from each play is conclusive proof? Get outta here. The game tape is available, go watch it. I didn't realize TfL's analysis was being accepted as absolutely authoritative.
I agree that CJ too often has to avoid defenders in the backfield. Yes the blocking is generally poor. But why does he still suck when the OL actually does block reasonably well? Because, as I have said, he refuses to just run forward. |
That's how he's been his entire career. He's basically a one trick pony even though he's my favorite player. He does need to change the way he plays though now that the blocking is basically worse than college level players could do. We're idiots for resigning him when we didn't realize that CJ needs a crease to be effective. He's a small quick back that needs blocking. He isn't getting it and he's not adjusting his play style. That's partly on him but the overall issue is our front off doesn't know what the F*** they're doing putting a team together. |
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s_camp
Joined: 10 Dec 2010
Posts: 2215
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| Posted: Sun Sep 16, 2012 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Obie09 wrote: | | s_camp wrote: | | carpbeatch wrote: | | No dude, you are hilarious. You get actual picture evidence and you still want to argue your point. Nobody said he needs to have perfect blocking, hell I'd settle for decent blocking. Dude if there's constant penetration it screws with the timing of the play, which in return makes the back try to avoid the first guy. After that, the holes are gone man. But you've already developed in your mind what the problem is... so much so that even when some posts pictures and explanations of what happened each play, you refuse to believe it. Funny stuff |
You think a freeze frame from each play is conclusive proof? Get outta here. The game tape is available, go watch it. I didn't realize TfL's analysis was being accepted as absolutely authoritative.
I agree that CJ too often has to avoid defenders in the backfield. Yes the blocking is generally poor. But why does he still suck when the OL actually does block reasonably well? Because, as I have said, he refuses to just run forward. |
That's how he's been his entire career. He's basically a one trick pony even though he's my favorite player. He does need to change the way he plays though now that the blocking is basically worse than college level players could do. We're idiots for resigning him when we didn't realize that CJ needs a crease to be effective. He's a small quick back that needs blocking. He isn't getting it and he's not adjusting his play style. That's partly on him but the overall issue is our front off doesn't know what the F*** they're doing putting a team together. |
I have to disagree big time. He did not run like this in 2008, 2009, and early 2010. He was very aggressive and very willing to go straight into the fray. Something changed by the end of 2010 and has gotten worse since then. He turns his back when contact is coming. Early in his career that was out of the question.
But you're absolutely right that he's not adapting at this point. Regardless of what the fundamental problem is, I'm astounded that he, the linemen, and the coaching staff keep doing the same damn things every single week. I don't get it at all. |
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