| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
blueswedeshoes
Joined: 08 Jun 2011
Posts: 849
Location: WisKAHNsin
|
 Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:28 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
|
| PossibleCabbage wrote: | Generally with these sorts of sorts of procedures the heightened risk of catastrophic spinal injury is due to spinal stenosis that is frequently caused by this kind of surgery. Some people are prone to spinal stenosis to begin with (I believe Jeremy Thompson was), but Nick Collins has no prior history.
If he manages to recover from his surgery with no evidence of spinal stenosis, then there's no reason not to clear him from a medical perspective since his chance of catastrophic neck injury is no higher than it was before, and he's essentially identical to a normal person in every way except that he has slightly less neck flexibility. |
You are absolutely right, oh cabaceous one. McCarthy's caution is warranted, but when he and Ted hear from the doc what you just said they will run it by the lawyer and get Nick back to work.
People got to learn to trust you, Mr Cabbage.
_________________
| MNPackfan32 wrote: | | This team has enough Old Spice and State Farm leaders and not enough curb stomp you in a bar fight guys. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
GoPackGo
Joined: 12 Oct 2008
Posts: 2269
Location: Chicago
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
Every injury case is individual. You can't say "well this happened with player A, so expect the same with player B." Not how medical works.
For an example.
My dad used to play in a semi-pro basketball league is his 20s. One of my dad's teammates was about 6'3, 225 and blew out the ACL is his right knee coming down from a rebound. He never regained his speed/burst/flexibility even with extensive rehab, and as far as I know hasn't played basketball again. Now, my dad blew out his ACL in his right knee as well after colliding with another player's knee. Exact same injury, exact same rehab, but my dad was fine and back playing in 12-14 months. My dad wasn't half the athlete the 6'3 guy is, so why was he able to recover and not his teammate? The only limitation my dad has is occasional arthritis and this is 20+ years later.
Yes, I realize that a neck injury is more serious than a knee, but a lot of players have successful surgery on various parts of the body and no issues after except for aches and pains in their old age due to the surgery.
I don't have a personal stake in this. I love football, but not enough for a man to risk a catastrophic re-injury. However, there's always a chance for a catastrophic neck injury playing football, surgery or not. If Nick has no better chance at an injury like that than any other player on the roster, who are we or the coaching staff to tell him he's not allowed to take that risk?
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Arodsmightybelt
Joined: 20 Dec 2010
Posts: 877
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 5:29 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| incognito_man wrote: | great...
if he's back, that's $4million less TT can spend in free agency this offseason.
Goodbye Mario Williams. |
your doing it right. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Polaris
Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 3027
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
As I have said from the beginning, there's only the slimmest of possibilities that he'll play for the Packers again. I've watched the Packers lose guys like Tim Lewis and Sterling Sharpe, Garry Berry and Terrence Murphy and Jeremy Thompson.
I do not ever recall one instance where a player has suffered a neck injury bad enough to keep him out for the season who has returned to play. Not one.
Again, this is not going to be Collins decision. The Packers will clear him or not and if past is any predictor then they won't. They will draft a new safety and move forward into the future rather than holding their collective breath every time Collins is slow to get up after a hard collision.
Be happy for Nick Collins. He's made some money, got to score a TD in the Super Bowl, and he has his health and a life ahead of him. Every player gets replaced sooner or later and in his case it was a little sooner than he wanted but he's still got a pretty good life.
But he's done playing football for the Packers. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BobSacamano
Joined: 22 Aug 2006
Posts: 12732
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Polaris wrote: |
But he's done playing football for the Packers. |
Wrap it up here fellas, Moses has come down from the mount.
_________________
| KingTarvaris7 wrote: | | last year's vikings were far better than the packers team that just won |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
xDD80x
Joined: 28 Dec 2009
Posts: 935
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Polaris wrote: | | I do not ever recall one instance where a player has suffered a neck injury bad enough to keep him out for the season who has returned to play. Not one. |
Robert Ferguson.
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kampman74
Joined: 30 Apr 2007
Posts: 5571
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Polaris wrote: | As I have said from the beginning, there's only the slimmest of possibilities that he'll play for the Packers again. I've watched the Packers lose guys like Tim Lewis and Sterling Sharpe, Garry Berry and Terrence Murphy and Jeremy Thompson.
I do not ever recall one instance where a player has suffered a neck injury bad enough to keep him out for the season who has returned to play. Not one.
Again, this is not going to be Collins decision. The Packers will clear him or not and if past is any predictor then they won't. They will draft a new safety and move forward into the future rather than holding their collective breath every time Collins is slow to get up after a hard collision.
Be happy for Nick Collins. He's made some money, got to score a TD in the Super Bowl, and he has his health and a life ahead of him. Every player gets replaced sooner or later and in his case it was a little sooner than he wanted but he's still got a pretty good life.
But he's done playing football for the Packers. |
I agree, Collins had a great career and now its time to think about family and living a normal life. I don't see how he come back at all if so much of his job involves taking hits. I am not getting my hopes up to have them crushed. Collins is/was and always will be one of my favorite Packers of all time, wish him the best of luck in whatever he decides to do in his future endeavors.
_________________
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
nfldraftguru1
Joined: 07 Feb 2009
Posts: 8036
Location: eau claire, wi
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Kampman74 wrote: | | Polaris wrote: | As I have said from the beginning, there's only the slimmest of possibilities that he'll play for the Packers again. I've watched the Packers lose guys like Tim Lewis and Sterling Sharpe, Garry Berry and Terrence Murphy and Jeremy Thompson.
I do not ever recall one instance where a player has suffered a neck injury bad enough to keep him out for the season who has returned to play. Not one.
Again, this is not going to be Collins decision. The Packers will clear him or not and if past is any predictor then they won't. They will draft a new safety and move forward into the future rather than holding their collective breath every time Collins is slow to get up after a hard collision.
Be happy for Nick Collins. He's made some money, got to score a TD in the Super Bowl, and he has his health and a life ahead of him. Every player gets replaced sooner or later and in his case it was a little sooner than he wanted but he's still got a pretty good life.
But he's done playing football for the Packers. |
I agree, Collins had a great career and now its time to think about family and living a normal life. I don't see how he come back at all if so much of his job involves taking hits. I am not getting my hopes up to have them crushed. Collins is/was and always will be one of my favorite Packers of all time, wish him the best of luck in whatever he decides to do in his future endeavors. |
If the docs OK him, he will and probably should come back. He hasn't loaded up on a ton of $ and he's an elite S and if the docs say he's okay then he's okay.
_________________
packer backer forever-ker
Packerbacker87's work
| Quote: | | Just like anything, the more you know, the more you realize you don't know. |
Follow me @rcon14 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
wiscsports28
Joined: 05 Feb 2010
Posts: 1653
Location: Milwaukee, WI
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Dubyajay
Joined: 23 Mar 2010
Posts: 1351
|
| Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| GoPackGo wrote: | Every injury case is individual. You can't say "well this happened with player A, so expect the same with player B." Not how medical works.
For an example.
My dad used to play in a semi-pro basketball league is his 20s. One of my dad's teammates was about 6'3, 225 and blew out the ACL is his right knee coming down from a rebound. He never regained his speed/burst/flexibility even with extensive rehab, and as far as I know hasn't played basketball again. Now, my dad blew out his ACL in his right knee as well after colliding with another player's knee. Exact same injury, exact same rehab, but my dad was fine and back playing in 12-14 months. My dad wasn't half the athlete the 6'3 guy is, so why was he able to recover and not his teammate? The only limitation my dad has is occasional arthritis and this is 20+ years later.
Yes, I realize that a neck injury is more serious than a knee, but a lot of players have successful surgery on various parts of the body and no issues after except for aches and pains in their old age due to the surgery.
I don't have a personal stake in this. I love football, but not enough for a man to risk a catastrophic re-injury. However, there's always a chance for a catastrophic neck injury playing football, surgery or not. If Nick has no better chance at an injury like that than any other player on the roster, who are we or the coaching staff to tell him he's not allowed to take that risk? |
This is a really good post.
People should really understand the bolded part.
_________________
| McThreadski wrote: |
Fear of re-injuring is a real thing. Years ago, I messed up my left leg in a freak break dancing incident... I never recovered mentally from it and I no longer "own" the dance floor at weddings and bar mitzvahs. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Polaris
Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 3027
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:02 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
I think some of you are missing the point.,
It isn't the doctor's decision. Dr. McKenzie can clear him medically, but that's it. And it isn't Collins' decision. It's the team's decision, specifically Ted Thompson's. And the powers that be don't want to have to hold their breath every time Nick Collins is involved in a hard hit or is slow to get up.
So they're going to do everything in their power to convince Nick to retire and spend time with his wife and four kids. And if they can't, then they'll release him. But they aren't going to be party to him reinjuring himself no matter how remote that possibility is. You can provide all the medical rationale you want but it's always going to come down to these three words: Surgically. Repaired. Neck.
Somebody above said that Robert Ferguson came back to the Packers after a bad neck injury. I presume that you're referring to missing the final three games of the 2004 season following a very hard/borderline dirty hit in the Jacksonville game. I was under the impression this was a concussion, not a neck injury. I could be wrong. But the vast majority of neck injuries are career enders as far as the Packers are concerned.
If you're a long term guy like Thompson, it's much better to replace Collins in this draft than to expose yourself to this risk. He's a conservative guy and he's not going to take the chance.
I'd bet a six pack of Pabst on this. Collins is done with Green Bay. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
packattack19
Joined: 17 Feb 2008
Posts: 1685
Location: NJ
|
| Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2012 9:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Polaris wrote: | I think some of you are missing the point.,
It isn't the doctor's decision. Dr. McKenzie can clear him medically, but that's it. And it isn't Collins' decision. It's the team's decision, specifically Ted Thompson's. And the powers that be don't want to have to hold their breath every time Nick Collins is involved in a hard hit or is slow to get up.
So they're going to do everything in their power to convince Nick to retire and spend time with his wife and four kids. And if they can't, then they'll release him. But they aren't going to be party to him reinjuring himself no matter how remote that possibility is. You can provide all the medical rationale you want but it's always going to come down to these three words: Surgically. Repaired. Neck.
Somebody above said that Robert Ferguson came back to the Packers after a bad neck injury. I presume that you're referring to missing the final three games of the 2004 season following a very hard/borderline dirty hit in the Jacksonville game. I was under the impression this was a concussion, not a neck injury. I could be wrong. But the vast majority of neck injuries are career enders as far as the Packers are concerned.
If you're a long term guy like Thompson, it's much better to replace Collins in this draft than to expose yourself to this risk. He's a conservative guy and he's not going to take the chance.
I'd bet a six pack of Pabst on this. Collins is done with Green Bay. |
But the thing is if he is a point where he is not at any greater risk than any other player on the field than Thompson and the front office with hold their breath on every hard hit he makes the same as they would Peprah, Burnett, Woodson...
_________________
Thanks for the sig Bucktuck |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Polaris
Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 3027
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| packattack19 wrote: | | Polaris wrote: | I think some of you are missing the point.,
....... it's always going to come down to these three words: Surgically. Repaired. Neck........ But the vast majority of neck injuries are career enders as far as the Packers are concerned.
... Thompson, ..'s a conservative guy and he's not going to take the chance.
I'd bet a six pack of Pabst on this. Collins is done with Green Bay. |
But the thing is if he is a point where he is not at any greater risk than any other player on the field than Thompson and the front office with hold their breath on every hard hit he makes the same as they would Peprah, Burnett, Woodson... |
OK, let's have it your way. The doctor says "the risk to you is no greater than it is to a player that hasn't had his neck surgically repaired".
And let's say Collins wants to play. AND HIS WIFE wants him to play. And the Packer organization signs off on it and Collins returns. And he comes back and takes a disabling hit. The #1 story in the league.
Who is to blame? The doctor? Collins himself? The organization clearing him? You don't think those questions would be asked over and over and you don't think it'll distract the team?
Thompson is far too conservative to expose the team to something like this. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Sandybaby716
Joined: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 3526
Location: Rhode Island
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Polaris wrote: | OK, let's have it your way. The doctor says "the risk to you is no greater than it is to a player that hasn't had his neck surgically repaired".
And let's say Collins wants to play. AND HIS WIFE wants him to play. And the Packer organization signs off on it and Collins returns. And he comes back and takes a disabling hit. The #1 story in the league.
Who is to blame? The doctor? Collins himself? The organization clearing him? You don't think those questions would be asked over and over and you don't think it'll distract the team?
Thompson is far too conservative to expose the team to something like this. |
Not sure you get it.
First, PC had a very good post about spinal stenosis on the last page. That's the main reason why people don't return. If Collins is diagnosed with this, then I agree there is no chance of us seeing him on a football field again.
If he doesn't have it, then our hands are tied. What do we do, release him? After seeing he doesn't have stenosis, the other teams would jump at a chance to get him. He certainly wouldn't retire.
As fans, we are clinging to that glimmer of hope that he doesn't have stenosis. I think there's actually a pretty high chance he does. But his optimism may be spawned from him already knowing that he doesn't have it. If that's the case, then he will almost guaranteed be back.
I still think he may not even be cleared to play.
_________________
| wgbeethree wrote: | | In all fairness it is kind of rude to just lay injured at their feet while the Lions defensive players are trying to hold a completely unrelated dance party. |
 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Lambeau__Leap
Joined: 01 Feb 2012
Posts: 262
|
| Posted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 2:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
|
| xDD80x wrote: | | Polaris wrote: | | I do not ever recall one instance where a player has suffered a neck injury bad enough to keep him out for the season who has returned to play. Not one. |
Robert Ferguson. |
Good ol' Robert Ferguson.
Anyway I realllllly hope this is true, I miss Nick.
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a87ymGOh-OI |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
|
FAQ
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
