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GoLdRuSh
Joined: 13 Dec 2007
Posts: 1691
Location: Sun DieGo
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 Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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| kurtsimonw wrote: | Would like to follow South American football more but it just confuses me.  |
Dont understand why its confusing??
Also I haven't watched Libertadores since my Chivas got slaughtered by Porto Alegre. I almost flew out to Brazil to see the final.
My dad is a huge fan that really lives by one of "their" songs; "Yo te sigo a todas partes.... Cada día te quiero más" And was willingly to buy our tickets but had a scheduling conflict. In hindsight its almost better we didnt go cause he would have been soooo miserable.
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kurtsimonw
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 709
Location: Birmingham, England
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| Posted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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| GoLdRuSh wrote: | | kurtsimonw wrote: | | Would like to follow South American football more but it just confuses me. |
Dont understand why its confusing?? |
The way relegation works and all this 'state championship' stuff I don't get. It seems like Brazil and Argentina's leagues work in a different way too. Just seems very different to what I'm used to and I don't really get how it works.
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Boreas
Joined: 29 Sep 2010
Posts: 409
Location: São Paulo
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| Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| kurtsimonw wrote: |
The way relegation works and all this 'state championship' stuff I don't get. It seems like Brazil and Argentina's leagues work in a different way too. Just seems very different to what I'm used to and I don't really get how it works. |
The issue with the south american leagues is that each country holds it's competitions with a different format and schedule.
The argentinean league is completely different from the brazilian league, the colombian and mexican leagues have also a very particular format of competition.
I'll explain the brazilian leagues.
The state championships are literally what they mean, they are championships among in-state teams, so the clubs will compete in a league against clubs from the same state only. Brasil has 27 states, so it's one league for each. These tournaments are held between February and May, and they happen before the national championship begins. The format of these competitions also varies between states, but usually there's a group phase and playoffs.
The state championships are a traditional and old competition, they are actually older than the national championship, which really started only in the 70's, while there were some tournaments between teams from various states before, the champions of these weren't officially recognized as "brazilian champions".
The rest of brazilian competitions are similar to the european ones, just the schedule that's totally different.
There's the national championship which is a league like the EPL and La Liga, the brazilian cup, which is a playoff competition like the FA Cup and Copa del Rey (that is held simultaneously with the state championships and Copa Libertadores, which means, in the first semester of the year).
The main difference here is that a brazilian player has, as you might have noticed, more games per season than the europeans and his schedule is a lot different. So when comparing stats, like Pelé's over 1000 goals scored, you got to take that in consideration.
So if a player is signed by an european club in August, he's in the middle of the season already and would be on vacation in December, but if he's playing for an european club, he'll still be playing through December and January, thus, his conditioning might suffer and he might even have injuries.
Hernanes was a good example of this last season. He was on top form as expected when just signed by Lázio, but as the season went on, he started to wear down and his 2nd half of the season was inferior to the first one. That's a common thing for brazilian players when tranfered to Europe by July-August transfer window. |
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kurtsimonw
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 709
Location: Birmingham, England
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| Posted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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Thanks for that, always interesting to know. Cheers.
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Boreas
Joined: 29 Sep 2010
Posts: 409
Location: São Paulo
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
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ElReyDeLosReyes
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 7964
Location: University of Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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| Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
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Patro14
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 8427
Location: South America
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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U de Chile vs Colo Colo (chilean derby) ended in the most tragic, epic way I've ever seen with the best OG ever at minute 113'.
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RoxSox2004
Joined: 17 Mar 2010
Posts: 16721
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 8:16 pm Post subject: |
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| ElReyDeLosReyes wrote: | | Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
Not even a little bit. Madrid seem to be more concerned with getting a player that will sell shirts, instead of someone who can win them games. They could have had Hazard for half that.
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The Wyzzinator
Joined: 10 Jan 2007
Posts: 13877
Location: Maryland
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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| RoxSox2004 wrote: | | ElReyDeLosReyes wrote: | | Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
Not even a little bit. Madrid seem to be more concerned with getting a player that will sell shirts, instead of someone who can win them games. They could have had Hazard for half that. |
Neymar's price is the one thing keeping me hopeful that they won't drop 90+ million euro's in one transfer window for attacking players on a team where they seem to at least have decent attacking depth i.e 2 of the most prolific attackers in the world already in Ronaldo and Ozil.
But I'm sure Madrid fans won't be happy unless Hazard & Neymar are both wearing white.
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| BaltimoreTerp wrote: | | Dr. Philly wrote: | | M'Villa's stock has soared way down since last year. |
Yeah that's not really how that works... |
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dotmotion
Joined: 21 May 2008
Posts: 10447
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2011 9:02 pm Post subject: |
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| RoxSox2004 wrote: | | ElReyDeLosReyes wrote: | | Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
Not even a little bit. Madrid seem to be more concerned with getting a player that will sell shirts, instead of someone who can win them games. They could have had Hazard for half that. |
Its not fair to say Neymar won't win them matches the same way Hazard will. Neymar has done brilliant things in the Brazilian League at an amazingly young age. It is the best league outside Europe and definitely top 10 in the world. He has also been able to play well for Brazil. Also, from their stats and the few Belgium and Brazil games I have seen, Neymar has played a lot better than Hazard has for his country.
Yeah Neymar is worth twice more, but he might be just as good if not better than Hazard. Add in the immense commercial revenue that I am sure would triple Hazard's, they got themselves a pretty good deal if he lives up to potential.
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Boreas
Joined: 29 Sep 2010
Posts: 409
Location: São Paulo
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| Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 3:53 pm Post subject: |
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| ElReyDeLosReyes wrote: | | Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
No, I don't find it justifiable. But there are a lot of deals around that aren't justifiable as well, which doesn't mean Real Madrid should make the same mistake.
His agent is playing the game the way he should though. The prices of the european football transfers are extremely inflated, and your team, Manchester City and Chelsea are the major responsibles for that. It's a bubble that's gonna blow like it did with the Calcio.
Aside from that, maybe Real Madrid has good reasons to spend so much on that player, but I say Neymar's very much a high risk, high reward deal.
Mourinho must be really sure of the deal before Real Madrid goes for it, more than he would usually in his other transfers.
| Quote: | | Not even a little bit. Madrid seem to be more concerned with getting a player that will sell shirts, instead of someone who can win them games. They could have had Hazard for half that. |
You're right about the "selling shirts" part. Neymar's worth 45 million euros as footballer, that is his transfer fee release clause with Santos. But the issue here is that they have to pay for his image rights with his sponsors, which are many...
Considering that Neymar has great marketing value in Brasil and isn't going to lose much on that after a transfer to Real Madrid, he'll only expand it so, we can see what Real Madrid is trying to get with this deal. You blame them?
Because it's not like they aren't also going to get a player that can be succesful, so it's not "only" to sell shirts.
He's better than Hazard and has greater marketing value. If you think Hazard is worth 30 million euros, maybe Neymar is really worth twice, all things considered. |
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Oregon Ducks
Joined: 28 Feb 2006
Posts: 12891
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| Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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We clinched our ticket to Copa Libertadores this past weekend. 
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ElReyDeLosReyes
Joined: 14 Feb 2009
Posts: 7964
Location: University of Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1p_2IcCWnM
^ The four goals that Neymar scored.
That third goal is amazing.
| Boreas wrote: | | ElReyDeLosReyes wrote: | | Boreas wrote: | This weekend, Neymar scored 4 goals in a 4-1 win of Santos over Atlético-PR.
With those goals, Neymar got to the impressive mark of 96 goals scored in his entire career and he's 19 years old.
For the brazilian national team, he has been the top goalscorer under Mano Menezes.
Scored on his debut in a friendly against the USA and continued to score goals regularly since them. |
People say he's not worth the 60 million euro price tag (rumored to be the price next summer with Real Madrid, but with the image rights that are owned by other companies that have to be paid to own him completely, do you find the price somewhat justifiable? |
No, I don't find it justifiable. But there are a lot of deals around that aren't justifiable as well, which doesn't mean Real Madrid should make the same mistake.
His agent is playing the game the way he should though. The prices of the european football transfers are extremely inflated, and your team, Manchester City and Chelsea are the major responsibles for that. It's a bubble that's gonna blow like it did with the Calcio.
Aside from that, maybe Real Madrid has good reasons to spend so much on that player, but I say Neymar's very much a high risk, high reward deal.
Mourinho must be really sure of the deal before Real Madrid goes for it, more than he would usually in his other transfers.
| Quote: | | Not even a little bit. Madrid seem to be more concerned with getting a player that will sell shirts, instead of someone who can win them games. They could have had Hazard for half that. |
You're right about the "selling shirts" part. Neymar's worth 45 million euros as footballer, that is his transfer fee release clause with Santos. But the issue here is that they have to pay for his image rights with his sponsors, which are many...
Considering that Neymar has great marketing value in Brasil and isn't going to lose much on that after a transfer to Real Madrid, he'll only expand it so, we can see what Real Madrid is trying to get with this deal. You blame them?
Because it's not like they aren't also going to get a player that can be succesful, so it's not "only" to sell shirts.
He's better than Hazard and has greater marketing value. If you think Hazard is worth 30 million euros, maybe Neymar is really worth twice, all things considered. |
Thanks for your answer and insight, Boreas! Mourinho has given the thumbs up as he wants to continue the youth players with high potential movement. His marketing is why Florentino Perez is fine with acquiring him and thus wants to give him as a "gift" to Mourinho. |
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Patro14
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 8427
Location: South America
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| Posted: Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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Universidad de Chile beating 2-0 Vasco da Gama at 75' and sealing their place on Copa Sudamericana's final.
Impressive, breaking club and national records as they play games. Best team in South America at the moment, their attacking football is just amazing.
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Patro14
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 8427
Location: South America
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| Posted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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BOCA CAMPEON!!!!!
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